Superman (2025)

Started by Travesty, Tue, 27 Jun 2023, 20:37

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Sat, 17 Feb 2024, 02:28 #21 Last Edit: Sat, 17 Feb 2024, 02:32 by thecolorsblend

In brief, this YouTuber is skeptical of the Gunnverse's prospects. He outlines his reasons as to why. Some of which have already been mentioned in this thread and others.

And, like me, he's even more skeptical of Superman's prospects as a successful film franchise. Obviously, I love Superman and want to believe that he'll always have massive, enduring popularity.

But "massive and enduringly popular" is not how I would summarize Superman's big screen exploits since 2006 going right on through to right now.

To be clear, I'm not rooting for SL's failure. Yet. I'm just saying that I don't think Superman has the mainstream appeal now that he had back in the Fifties and Sixties.

The title has been changed to just 'Superman'. Not a fan. We've already had that with the 1978 film and at least Legacy was distinctive. Changing the title also makes me feel uneasy because it communicates chaos and uncertainty, regardless if that's real or imagined. This movie feels like make or break for the cinematic fortunes of the character. If people aren't interested now when will they be? Even if the movie is good it still needs to make money. It's possible Superman has been left behind for a number of reasons. It's a shame Gunn is the man behind the camera. He is a creep and a liar. Let's see what happens.


James Gunn: "The biggest problem with superhero movies today is cameo porn".

Also James Gunn: Praises The Flash when it's loaded with cameos and is making a Superman movie with too many heroes taking the spotlight away from the main character.

If this farce doesn't get shelved, I hope it flops faster than a speeding bullet.
QuoteJonathan Nolan: He [Batman] has this one rule, as the Joker says in The Dark Knight. But he does wind up breaking it. Does he break it in the third film?

Christopher Nolan: He breaks it in...

Jonathan Nolan: ...the first two.


Okay, so Gunn released a glimpse of the Superman ("Legacy" is no longer part of the title) suit.

There are obvious similarities to this symbol and Kingdom Come.

What's less obvious, and what pretty much nobody else is talking about, is the similarity to the Superman- Earth One symbol.

Specifically, the gold outline. This design element is unique to JMS's Earth One Superman. Off the top of my head, I can't think of any other version that ever included this feature.

One question I've got is whether the cape will include a symbol on the back. Bryan Singer omitted the cape symbol to simplify life for the visual effects team. Zack Snyder deleted it because he thought the cape would look better without the symbol.

So, it would be kind of nice if someone would add it back to Superman's cape. I'm getting a little tired of the cape symbol getting written out of existence.

Anyway. Thoughts?

Like the yellow emblem for Batman that had been absent for too long, I'm hoping the yellow logo is back on Superman's cape. While I think this should serve as a celebration of classic Superman tropes (he needs it after so many evil/brainwashed plot lines), I'm also hoping we see a ton of stuff that's new to the films as well. Don't hold anything back thinking there will be other films to expand into. Put it on the screen now. Krypto. Brainiac. Galactic travel. A proper Fortress decked out with futuristic technology and relics.

Man, I've been trying to be positive about this new cinematic reboot, but man, I really hate this suit reveal. It's too baggy with lots of padding. It just looks incredibly cheap.


Mon, 6 May 2024, 20:47 #27 Last Edit: Mon, 6 May 2024, 20:58 by The Dark Knight
I'm usually wait and see with these suits, but this is an official still image. I agree completely. Looks cheap and too baggy. Given all the discourse about Snyder and Cavill being too dark, the Gunn reveal is set at night and not bathed in sunshine. Which makes it feel like an inferior knockoff to the real deal we just had. Superman also has a dead in the face expression. Where's the smiling we always apparently needed to have? He looks like a weary firefighter sick of going out to work, reluctantly putting on the uniform.

Tue, 7 May 2024, 04:14 #28 Last Edit: Wed, 8 May 2024, 20:36 by thecolorsblend
-- The Good
I sort of like the composition going on here. It looks like it could be a comic book cover. Big Giant Threat outside the window. And Superman is so accustomed to this type of thing that he resolutely gets his other business suit on to take care of Big Giant Threat.

I also like the colors in this photo. They pop pretty well. Considering my reintroduction to Superman on film was in that bland, dull publicity photo released from Superman Returns, anything is better than that.

Speaking of colors, I like how colorful the suit is. The SR suit was dull and muddy. I never approved of that wine-colored Fruit Rollup SR cape. So, the coloring on this new suit is right in my wheelhouse.

It LOOKS like the red trunks have been restored, which I think is also a bonus.

-- The Bad
I think I'll always prefer the low collar on the tunic that Snyder favored. It should show a bit of Superman's chest. The high collar seems influenced by The New 52. In fact, the high collar, the piping on the sleeves and chest, the clunky boots, ALL of that seems very New 52 to me. On that note, this uniform seems to be a strange amalgamation of the Earth One uniform, that New 52 uniform and a bit of Kingdom Come thrown in.

I don't think blending those various aesthetics together is creatively successful.

The enterprise looks cheap, like something you'd expect to see in a CW show. In fact, this looks like only a minor upgrade over the Superman outfit Tyler Hoechlin has been running around in for the past several seasons.

I, for one, NEVER needed them to bring the Reeve outfit out of mothballs. You all know me better than that. But I do believe there's a lot of mojo to the idea of a simple Superman outfit. Singer disregarded that. Snyder disregarded that. And now, it sure looks like Gunn is disregarding it too.

I called the red trunks above a bonus. And I stand by that. But I also question if modern audiences will accept them. There are reasons to think they won't. In fact, there are reasons to question Superman's entire box office viability at this point. And that would be my opinion even if comic book cinema wasn't the train wreck that it is today. But considering how the market appears to be shifting, I would've figured the best approach would be to make the most commercial aesthetic possible. And I don't think the red trunks fit into that equation, frankly.

-- The Ugly
Wtf is going on with that bulk? Is it padding or something? It's most noticeable in the shoulders and lower torso. Of all characters, I thought Superman's suit should look as skintight as possible. He is his own armor. Plus, it seems dramatically appropriate to emphasize his muscularity. Padding (or at least a bulky outfit) ruins that aesthetic.

-- Summary
I'm... not overly confident about this outfit. I don't think this is the visual direction that Superman in cinema should be headed into. The confused aesthetic influences, the strangely fitted uniform, the clunky boots, they all fit together to create a deep sense of reluctance on my part.

Yes, I wanted the Snyderverse (starring Cavill as Superman) to continue/be restored. But I was willing to give a reboot a fair shot. I'm not blinded by devotion here. Even so, this uniform design isn't inspiring very much in the way of confidence.

For all I know, Gunn will make the masterpiece Superman film that I've wanted my entire life. But even if he does, I'll still have to find a way to reconcile this suit design instead of celebrate it.

I look back at Dean Cain's Superman uniform from L&C's fourth season. For everything that show was and wasn't, that uniform was consistent with the rest of the series. Specifically, it had a homemade quality to it with a big and highly stylized chest symbol. Just to look at Cain wearing the outfit, you instantly understood something about L&C's approach to Superman as a character AND the tone of the show. Yes, it WAS a simple design. But it was also an effective design.

Gunn's Superman outfit is NOT a simple design. And it also doesn't seem to be a very effective design either.

My reluctance about this film has not been assuaged in the slightest.

Snyder had the right idea in removing the red diaper. It was modern, fresh and simply time to move in that direction on film IMO. The argument there's too much blue without them doesn't hold water anymore for me. Having them back just feels like a giant regression. Batman films since 1989 have gone without diapers and it's been fine. It's okay in animation and comics, but right now in a 2024/5 movie it's just out of place and a source of amusement. Don't worry, I get all the historical meaning behind them.