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Messages - BurtonBatman

#21
I just reread this again.  Even though its not my favorite Burton Batfilm, I still find the film interesting.  I've always had a mixed opinion about BR.  I want to love it as much as B89 because of Keaton/Burton/Elfman and a darker Batman, but I also want to hate it because it was too perverse (I mean all the sexual inuendos in the film) and it had more artistic influences rather than those from the source material (comics).  I often ask myself, why I own this film, but I can't get rid of it either.  I don't know, maybe with time I'll get what others think about this film, but this thread was a definite help.

Also, mods, I believe this thread deserves a sticky as well.  Last request, I promise ;)
#22
I advocate another sticky ;D
#23
Quote from: thecolorsblend on Tue, 22 Jul  2008, 05:30"Turning them on the ear" is one thing.  Throwing them out, creating new characters and slapping existing names on them is quite another.

But isn't this exactly what Tim Burton did in BR?

On another note, I saw influences from Batman #1 and TKJ in Ledger's performance.  The Joker is more serious than funny in Batman #1, and The Joker's insanity was captured very well from TKJ.  Aside from Ledger's appearance, I felt he captured the character very well. 
#24
IMO, TDK is the best Batman film ever and will probably gain recognition from the Academy for it, as will Heath's performance.  I'll copy my review from BOF as soon as spoilers are allowed, or a TDK review thread that allows spoilers is started here.  In short, If I had to pick a favorite between B89 and TDK I couldn't right now. 

#25
Well thecolorsblend, call the shrink.  I now put TDK on EQUAL footing with B89  ;)
#26
Thanks BatmAngelus.  It seems that there were some comic influences in BR, at least more than I thought, which was very little.
#27
Please sticky ;D
#28
Quote from: BatmAngelus on Fri, 18 Jul  2008, 16:02
By coincidences, I mean that the similarities may not mean that they are entirely from The Killing Joke.
For example, the shot of Batman on the rooftop looking at the Bat-Signal- I would think that this is a pretty standard shot in Batman comics.  Plus, the composition and pose for Batman is different than the shot in the last frame of the film.
Same goes for the Batcomputer with multiple screens and the Batmobile storming through Joker's hideout- which I think may have been pretty common in the comics.  I could be wrong though.

Gotcha.

Quote from: BatmAngelus on Fri, 18 Jul  2008, 16:02
As for the chemical bath origin, as you probably know, 1951's The Man Behind The Red Hood had the same origin.  The biggest difference is that The Red Hood/pre-Joker was a criminal whom Batman was tracking, much like Jack Napier. 
I find that story more likely to have influenced Sam Hamm because his first draft of the script, which features the same origin as the movie, is dated 1987 whereas The Killing Joke did not come out until 1988, making The Man Behind The Red Hood story his only reference for writing those scenes.

No, I did not know about the Man Behind the Red Hood, thanks again for the history lesson.  B89 brought me to Batman and only in the last year or two have I delved into comics, so I have a bit of catchup to do  ;).  And your point regarding TKJ and when it came out makes perfect sense.

This thread truly deserves a sticky.  Perhaps you and your cohorts should write a book delving into the comic influences of all the Batfilms ;).
#29
Quote from: BatmAngelus on Fri, 18 Jul  2008, 01:24
Michael Uslan in the intro for Batman In The Fifties: Apparently, the Batmobile of 1950 "would also be the primary influence for genius production designer Anton Furst, who imagineered the 1989 Batmobile for the first Batman feature, winning an Oscar for his creative efforts."
The Batmobile of 1950 gave the car its trademark "long" look as well as the flaming afterburner in the back of the vehicle that probably gave Furst the influence.

This is interesting.  When I was rereading my Batman Chronicles #1 recently, I noticed that the red "high powered" car Batman uses in DC#30 in part 2 of the Hugo Strange arc looked similar  to the B89/BR Batmobile in that it was long.  I thought that must have been the primary influence, but I guess not. 

Quote from: BatmAngelus on Fri, 18 Jul  2008, 01:53
I'm sure that I, or someone else, could dig up a few similarities in visuals between The Killing Joke and the film as well.  
While I know that the comic was influential on Burton, I don't really see a lot of it in the movie, aside from a few similarities that could be coincidences (i.e. the chemical bath origin, the Batcomputer with multiple screens, a shot of Batman on the rooftop next to the Bat-Signal, the Batmobile rushing into the Joker's hideout).  I'll be happy to be proven wrong, though.

Could you elaborate on what you mean by "coincidences?"  Are you saying that the Joker origin scenes in B89 could have had more direct influences by other sources?  I would consider the Joker frames you mentioned pretty direct influences.  What's the difference?

Quote from: BatmAngelus on Fri, 18 Jul  2008, 01:53
As for BB, I did the same with Begins at the DC Comments forum.  I can transfer it over to here, too.  And I'm sure there will be stuff from The Dark Knight...

Please do  ;D
#30
Quote from: BurtonBatman on Fri, 18 Jul  2008, 01:40
And are any of the above from Strange Apparitions?  

Posted too soon.  You answered my question preemptively ;).