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Messages - The Dark Knight

Movies / Re: Beetlejuice Beetlejuice (2024)
Sat, 20 Jul 2024, 10:39
"Spill your guts. Who wants to go first?"


This looks like it could be one of Burton's best.
Other comics / Re: Watchmen
Thu, 18 Jul 2024, 11:34
I've been thinking about one of Moore's other big works, V For Vendetta, and its comparison to Watchmen.

V wears the face of a historical villain, who actually carries out the acts Guy Fawkes only dreamed of. That alone makes him seem like another villain by default. Veidt's destruction of New York City can paint him in a villainous light as well.

I believe there's this idea Norsefire is some exclusively right wing regime nightmare, but I push back on that. Moore himself, speaking of the movie adaption, said it was a "largely impotent American liberal fantasy of someone with American liberal values standing up against a state run by neoconservatives – which is not what the comic V for Vendetta was about. It was about fascism, it was about anarchy, it was about England." When you look at what Norsefire actually do it has a lot in common with our modern existence.

We do have a surveillance state with government and big corporations aligning with each other for power. Media outlets have been taken over by 'the message' and are essentially State run propaganda. Traffickers and pedophiles (Saville, Epstein, etc) are abetted by those in authority, and people are financially desperate. In resisting that, V seems to take on the role of a real hero, despite destroying key iconic infrastructure like a terrorist, which he also is. Not to mention the civilian casualties those incidents would bring.

In Watchmen, Veidt used large scale destruction to persuade government to step away from Armageddon, not to outright remove it. By cleansing structure altogether you are bringing about lawlessness and the eventual rise of some other ruling force that could be even worse.

If a ruling force is past being reasoned with or scared into compliance it's a question of what other real options V has to bring about serious change from the street level, even if anarchy is not your chosen political persuasion. Both stories end with an uncertain future, but I'm sure either outcome (Norsefire or V's legacy of anarchy) isn't great and brings about their own set of problems.
I'll eventually check this out. Overall I like Snyder's movie and this has the potential to be a nice companion piece - even more faithful to the material and in animated form. For a while I've been interested in diving even more into content like Sandman and V For Vendetta. I love the themes and how morally grey things can be presented. But Watchmen would still be at the top of the tree for me. My appreciation only grows.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Mon,  8 Jul  2024, 13:39Bale also insisted on performing most of his own fight scenes. Of course stand-ins and doubles were still used on the Nolan trilogy, particularly on Batman Begins, but even so Bale likely did a higher percentage of batsuit scenes than Keaton, Kilmer or Clooney did. I get the impression that Pattinson took a similar method approach on The Batman, wanting to do as much as possible for himself and performing most of his own fights.
I appreciate that level of commitment but at the same time I'm happy for the stuntmen to bring those action scenes to life in the best way possible. The warehouse scene from BvS is a good example of that.

Keaton is best when he's using his eyes. The closeups on him inside the Batmobile with Vicki, and inside the cave trying to hide from Vicki. His DNA is there and most obviously in the Bruce Wayne scenes. It's a testament to him and doubles like Newman in the way the performances seamlessly transition in the film, and the others too.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Mon,  8 Jul  2024, 13:39It would be interesting to go through each Batman movie shot by shot and try to figure out who is wearing the suit at each moment.
I'd be very interested in that.
The Batman (2022) / Re: The Penguin (2024)
Wed, 10 Jul 2024, 12:06
It's going to be a busy end to the year with this, Caped Crusader and Joker 2. Right now I'm most interested in The Penguin, even though all three have my interest. I'm eager to see how closely Reeves' Gotham is replicated and where the story leads. I'm suspecting it'll be Oswald fully established as the big boss, and the series still being standalone and non essential for understanding The Batman Part II, but still enriching the experience. I'm feeling good about a Pattinson cameo too. I think that's going to happen.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun,  7 Jul  2024, 14:23None of this post is intended to take away from Keaton.
I think it can't help but impact the perception of Keaton to a degree and I say that as a fan. It almost changes from being labelled the Keaton Batman to the Burton Batman because of the people involved in bringing it to life. I admire the overall approach the creative team had with the terse dialogue and theatrical nature of his movements. Newman is in the suit for a lot of the loved sequences, of which some involve simply standing or walking. But if Newman was better placed to provide that performance then so be it. The character comes first.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun,  7 Jul  2024, 14:23But we've known about the significance of Lea's involvement for years now, and I thought it was time we gave Newman his due.
Absolutely. He's a huge unsung part of the film that deserves attention. When people were praising Keaton they were unknowingly praising Newman, but then again that's the nature of body doubling in feature films. B89 was made in a different time when actors weren't hitting the gym or doing extensive weapons training. Things worked out for the best because the depiction still hasn't been topped.
In City of Crime, Batman goes away for a while. But in that time he plants heavy explosives at the base of The Body, creatures of soil that have been ravaging Gotham. He leads them all there then lets the place rip Axis Chemicals style.

I dig this type of Batman. Doing whatever it takes to protect Gotham. I'd be fine with this course of action even if the Body weren't made of soil. It's their behavior that counts, and if it's threatening the populace to a serious degree it must be stopped the day before yesterday.
I'm glad the Arkham show has been cancelled. Once it morphed into a DCU project it lost all its appeal to me. I hold out hope we get one more TV series after The Batman Part II, and that doesn't have to be Arkham based. Something about Selina, or a spiritual sequel to The Penguin with gangster characters like Black Mask entering the scene. Fingers crossed Part II does start filming early next year as Serkis suggests. I think there's ample time to develop a second TV series, especially with the gaps they've been having in between.
Other DC Films & TV / Re: Superman (2025)
Sat, 6 Jul 2024, 01:52
I get the idea of secret identities (and Corenswet's look is definitely that), but something about Clark Kent always annoyed me when thinking of myself being that character. In a lot of incarnations and even by default Bruce Wayne gets to be Bruce Wayne. He's a billionaire, runs a successful company and lives in a mansion. He doesn't always lower himself to act the complete chump. He's not wealthy but Peter Parker also gets to be Peter Parker largely warts and all. The suit completely covering him gives that advantage. When Clark is presented normally and not a goofball, like Cavill, it then makes the secret identity even less believable.
Batman (1989) / Re: 35th Anniversary Thread
Wed, 3 Jul 2024, 11:52
My best memories of B89 are sitting down watching my VHS copy of the film I recorded off TV. I remember the cassette cover and how atmospheric that even looked, with BATMAN written on the front in blue pen. I can't put into words how important that movie or Batman himself was to me as a kid. Even if I didn't completely comprehend the intricacies of the plot, I definitely felt the vibe.

The descent into mystery, for example, is still unmatched in the way it captures what Batman is all about. There's something special about B89 that won't be replicated ever again. The journey to get it made, being the first serious live action adaption and the Beatlemania level hype it generated. Being released in my birth year means I'll truly always be connected to it.