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Finally, that LaRusso kid's gonna get what's coming to him.

I am so there. Holy balls, how did I not know about this?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCwwxNbtK6Y

This series is coming along at a pretty opportune time, I must say. I just finished a rewatch of the Karate Kid trilogy. I'm the guy in the room who enjoys all three of them. I really dig the arc Daniel goes through during the movies. So news of this YouTube series is pretty much what the doctor ordered.

My abiding hope is that this is Daniel and Johnny's story. I never really get into "passing the torch to the next generation" stuff that Hollywood has had such a boner for lately.

I rank the original Karate Kid trilogy just below the Rocky films as the second best sports movie franchise of the eighties. I never bothered watching The Next Karate Kid or the remake, though I've heard the remake is good on its own terms. But the original three films are gold. The second movie is one of the most underrated sequels ever and does a superb job of connecting the martial arts philosophy of the first film with the Okinawan origins of karate. I've always been a sucker for smirking over-the-top bad guys like Terry Silver, so the third one packs a lot of entertainment value too.

This web series looks like the ideal way to revisit that universe. Not as a big budget reboot, but as a character-driven comedy/drama centred around the original talent. And I agree about them focusing on Daniel and Johnny. The 'bring your kid to work day' trend for ageing action heroes was already growing stale back in 2008, so I can happily do without that here. Johnny is one of the most interesting characters in the Karate Kid series, as well as one of the more sympathetic antagonists in eighties cinema. I'm one of those people that views him as the misunderstood hero of the original film.


This is how it should have ended.


The new web series looks like it's getting the dynamic between him and Daniel just right. The latest trailer portrays Daniel as an arrogant bully, while Johnny seems to be the one striving to make amends for his bad life choices. Hopefully Martin Kove will make an appearance as John Kreese.

Right now this is shaping up to be my second most hyped TV/web series of 2018 after DD season 3. The release date is 2nd May, so we've not got long to wait.

I'm beginning to wonder that someone involved with the CK series didn't see that "Johnny is the hero" bit and think "You know, that's a good point!"

Speaking of, I get where that YouTube guy is coming from. But my evaluation of the first KK movie is that Miyagi and Kreese are at loggerheads with each other. Granted, that conflict is executed primarily through their deputies (eg, Daniel and Johnny). But ultimately the Miyagi and Kreese worldviews drive most of the conflicts of KK1.

Apart from being a defensible interpretation of KK1, that adds extra resonance to KK3. KK3 does everything the third chapter in a trilogy is supposed to do. It revisits the conflicts and themes of the first entry, often involving the same villain from that first entry, and shows the character getting torn down and built back up again. My view is that KK does everything a trilogy is supposed to do and it usually does them exceedingly well. I've never seen what the problem with KK3 was supposed to be.

Broadly, one thing KK1 in particular rarely gets credit for is portraying Kreese as sensei, Johnny as sempai and the other Cobra Kais as kohai. That same dynamic doesn't and can't exist on Miyagi's side since Daniel is his only student. But the hierarchy of Cobra Kai is depicted in a very traditional way.

What I enjoy about that is how it suggests that Kreese's understanding of true karate isn't flawed AT ALL. He has intentionally corrupted some things but left other things pure. It shows him to be a more competent and menacing villain when you realize that nothing he's done with his dojo is a mistake. Kreese isn't some idiot Westerner who doesn't understand what karate is supposed to be.

He understands perfectly; he's doing this on purpose. And Miyagi's implied moral outrage at Kreese is made even sweeter by the fact that Kreese is profaning something Miyagi holds sacred.

The KK trilogy has a lot to offer, if you ask me.

To answer the "Daniel as real bully" thing, there's merit to that. And my response is that Kreese isn't the only one being taught a lesson. Miyagi may have taught Daniel karate as a way of channeling his sociopathy. In fact, you could say those chickens came home to roost when Daniel ultimately decided to burn the All Valley tournament application in KK3 because he realized Miyagi is right; Daniel doesn't need this and shouldn't aspire to it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2t7qNQBthk

I'll be the first to admit that maybe I'm reading too much into this. But after watching this phony commercial, I'm starting to wonder if Daniel's arc in the series won't be his disgust that he's living a completely artificial life. He's a karate celebrity (apparently), maybe he's had some success doing MMA or something and now he's car dealership bigwig. He's got money, success, presumably a wife and family... but he's cheapening the disciplines his sensei taught him for money.

And then out of nowhere here comes Johnny. And for the first time maybe ever, Johnny is locked in on something good and positive about karate. Daniel, meanwhile, is almost prostituting karate.

What if the resurgent conflict between Johnny and Daniel revolves around Daniel making trouble for Johnny because he subconsciously understands Johnny is on a good path while Daniel himself (successful or not) is on a negative path? What if Daniel is lashing out against an "enemy" who doesn't even stop to consider him anymore because he, Daniel, is the one who is desecrating the discipline now?

But maybe I'm reading too much into this.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Wed, 28 Mar  2018, 20:34But maybe I'm reading too much into this.

No, I think you're on the right track. The price chopping is bad enough, but the free bonsai tree almost seems like a deliberate slight against Miyagi's spiritual outlook. One thing that elevated the Karate Kid trilogy above more schlocky martial arts films was the way they explored the philosophy of karate, illustrating that there's a right way and a wrong way to implement these skills. By divorcing the disciplines Miyagi taught him from their spiritual bedrock - and doing so for commercial gain - Daniel is treading on dangerous ground. Johnny might well be the one to straighten him out.

I like that it's unclear who the hero is in this show. Based on these trailers, the classic good guy/bad guy dynamic appears to have gone out the window. Instead we've got two flawed protagonists, each likeable and sympathetic in his own way, but neither emerging as the obvious lead. I genuinely don't know how this series is going to end, and that fact alone makes it more intriguing than 90% of what's out there.

Yep. If that's the direction this bad boy is going in, they have my respect. The easy thing would've been a Daniel/Johnny rematch. And who knows, that may still happen. And if so, I'm fine with it.

But a more complex tale about a fallen-from-grace hero and a risen-above-the-darkness villain is ballsy and I can't wait to see it.

The LaRusso Auto Group commercial made me wonder that the show's meat and potatoes will be Daniel falling far short of expectations. But this new teaser looks like a "Let's give the keys to the kids!" concept.

Perhaps Johnny's arc will include not just a purer notion of karate but exemplifying it by teaching that philosophy to his students?

There are a couple of different ways this might play out.

The last batch of videos kind of made me worry that this will be yet another "Give the kids the keys to the car" revival of something.

Oh well. If nothing else comes out of this, at least Johnny will get some more character development.

The first two episodes are up for free on YouTube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rB36UGoP4Y

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Aoc-cd9eYs

So far, I dig this. I like the journey that the characters are on. You and I called some of it. Johnny sees himself as the victim in the first Karate Kid movie. And there's some justification for that, I don't deny it. But whatever happened happened and he's never really recovered from it. So at the end of his tether, he embraces a darkness.

Daniel is different but the same. Life has been good to him. He's gotten soft. If he's not a yuppie, the word has no meaning. Johnny is embracing a darkness but Daniel isn't a saint. He's embraced a corruption.

Neither character is helpless. They can both recognize injustice and they're both capable of acting in defense of others. Neither of them are angels. But their respective falls aren't absolute either.

It's a fascinating moral paradigm. Daniel is raising some bratty kids who get into too much trouble. Johnny is (badly) mentoring a victim who needs an ideal to aspire to. Cobra Kai is not drawing simplistic moral lines so far. There is no black and there is no white; there are only different shades of gray.

The turning point comes at the end of the second episode. Johnny outright tells Daniel that his daughter is trouble and her friends are even worse. That fazes Daniel but it doesn't stop him. He threatens Johnny even though he now believes Johnny's actions are the definition of justice.

Thing is though, Johnny didn't act against injustice in fighting those teenagers. They attacked him so he defended himself. He wouldn't have gotten involved if it hadn't affected him.

But Johnny lets Daniel believe he was a hero even though, let's face it, he wasn't.

These are not simplistic moral lines.

If the rest of the show is as rich as these first two episodes, this will be a good ride.

I watched the first two episodes last night and I'm planning to binge watch the rest of the series this weekend. Based on the first two episodes, it's shaping up to be a great show. It's genuinely funny and made me laugh out loud on more than one occasion. My favourite moment so far was when Johnny smashed the kid's inhaler against the wall and told him he didn't have asthma anymore.

Ralph Macchio and William Zabka have both aged really well. Johnny's meant to be a broken down wreck, but Zabka's clearly in great shape. In real life he holds a black belt in Tang Soo Doo, and judging from how he handled those bullies in the first episode he's lost none of his skills. That fight scene was nicely staged. The choreography was smooth and it was shot and edited in a clear, coherent manner. I'm looking forward to more martial arts scenes like that as the series progresses.

Speaking of editing, I assume Johnny's driving montage in the first episode was an intentional nod to the 'No Easy Way Out' montage from Rocky IV.


You hit the nail on the head about the moral greyness. There's no clear hero or villain, which I think is what we were all hoping for. Johnny's sticking up for the underdog, but he only got involved in the first place because the bullies shoved the kid against his car. Until then, he hadn't cared what they were doing. Meanwhile Daniel's defending a bully, but is doing so for a noble reason. Both protagonists' goals are misaligned with their moral character, yet both of them are funny, likeable and sympathetic.

There seems to be a running theme about masculinity and the role fathers play in helping guide their sons from boyhood to manhood. Sadly we live in an age where masculinity is under constant attack. Male sexuality is pathologized with increasing regularity, rowdy schoolboys are medicated to make them act more like girls, college freshman are forced to attend compulsory 'consent classes' that treat them like potential rapists, and many traditionally masculine character virtues are now demonised and regarded as 'toxic'. It's no wonder young males are so confused about their role in society. I like that this series isn't afraid to veer into politically incorrect territory in showing how young men need harsh guidance to help straighten them out and toughen them up for the rigours of everyday life.

Johnny openly mocks his student for whining about 'genderised' language (is that even a real term?) and encourages him to embrace and channel his aggressive side. Obviously Johnny's approach is in many ways misguided, but the underlying principle of a father figure teaching a youngster to toughen himself up, take responsibility and "stop being a pussy" is an important one. Johnny had his own flawed father figure in the shape of Sensei Kreese, and now he's gone and botched the upbringing of his own son. Reopening the Cobra Kai dojo offers him a redemptive second shot at being a dad. Meanwhile Daniel benefited from the guidance of Miyagi in the absence of his own biological father, and as a result has matured into a patient and loving parent who's done a good job raising his kids. Only now he's taking a bully under his wing in a gesture of misdirected compassion. Both father figures are weaponising the youngsters to use as pawns in their battle against one another. It'll be interesting to see how that battle plays out.

SN, just finished episode 06. I am DIGGING this series. Tons of heart, plenty of humor, real drama, well-written characters, the whole enterprise is spot on so far. It's an ensemble piece and I appreciate that about it. It's not a "Let's turn everything over to the kids" train wreck like I feared. But neither is it a straight up nostalgia trip.

There's meat on the bone that's true to who these characters are. Their trajectories are believable considering what's come before. This show is taking a lot more risks than I ever would've guessed.

Finished the series. Something happens literally at the last minute... which got spoiled for me because some of these jackass headlines don't protect against that stuff. So that part wasn't a huge shock... though it might've been.

Apart from some vanishing subplots, this was overall a good series. I wasn't expecting it to be an ensemble piece. But I can't argue with how effective this works as an ensemble piece. I daresay it would be a lesser story if the focus was strictly on Daniel and Johnny.

No spoilers from me. At least not yet. Because this bad boy is worth watching with as many surprises as possible.

I finished the last episode. I thoroughly enjoyed the entire series.

I don't have any major criticisms, but if I was to highlight a few negatives I'd say the teen romance subplot didn't hold my interest as much as other aspects of the show. Once or twice the storytelling dipped into 'idiot plot' territory, with characters making incorrect assumptions that could have been easily dispelled with a simple verbal explanation. Other than a few soap opera moments like those, I thought the writing was generally strong. The dialogue was funny, the character arcs were well mapped out, and the overall tone struck a satisfying balance between drama and humour. It was a little contrived that the one girl Miguel fell for just happened to be Daniel's daughter, but considering almost every Charles Dickens novel features doubly improbable contrivances, it feels a bit pointless whining about it here.

Cobra Kai really is a character-driven show. I couldn't see it working as a feature film. The serialised TV format is better suited to this pace of storytelling and the 30 minute runtime for each episode works surprisingly well. So well in fact that I'm wondering if 30 minute episodes might be more appropriate for other serialised TV shows, rather than the standard 45-60 minute episodes. Would the pacing problems with the Marvel Netflix shows be resolved by having shorter 30 minute episodes? 60 minutes may work better for anthologised programmes showcasing standalone plots, but for this type of long-form narrative – which more closely resembles a novel than a short story – I think 30 minutes is perfectly adequate. The scripts do a wonderful job of presenting each character's unique perspective and making us care about them. With the exception of the high school bullies, everyone in this show has a likeable side. Consequently we, the viewers, feel just as conflicted watching the final round of the tournament as Johnny does. He's watching his star pupil fight his son; we're watching two good kids from rough backgrounds striving for balance in their lives.

The point about it not being a retread is the key to why it works. It tells a new story that's worth telling. Obviously structural parallels with the original film crop up during the final tournament, but that doesn't make it a retread. Any film set within a sporting field will to some degree have its narrative structure dictated by the sport in question. This is why I always defend the Rocky films from the criticism that they're formulaic. Ok, so each film ends with a boxing match. But they're boxing films – how else should they end? The same applies here. The Karate Kid films were always tournament fighters, and the new series continues that tradition. But the surrounding story is inventive and fresh. And when they do intentionally reference the older films, it's often done subversively for comic effect (Daniel clapping his hands together and calling for a medic was another laugh out loud moment for me).

Characterisation is where this show really shines. You'll start off liking one character and hating another, and by the end of the series your sympathies have totally flipped. I was rooting for characters like Miguel and Lip/Hawk for most of the season, but by the finale I was mentally booing them. Similarly I started off disliking Robby, but ended up cheering for him in the last episode. Daniel and Johnny are portrayed differently from their younger selves, but different in such a way that feels like an organic progression rather a total reinvention. I never had trouble believing these were the same characters from the original trilogy, and I appreciated seeing their arcs progress in new directions instead of just having them repeat what they did in the eighties. A part of me wanted to see Daniel and Johnny fight, but another part of me knows that that would have been easy fan service. They could build up to a Daniel vs. Johnny showdown in a future season, but I respect them for not doing so in season one.

I assumed this was going to be a standalone event series, but the final episode is clearly setting up more episodes to come. Fortunately I didn't have you-know-who's surprise appearance spoiled, so the final scene brought a huge smile to my face. Rather than see Daniel fight Johnny again, I'd be more interested in seeing Johnny fight that guy. Then have Daniel fight Terry Silver. Maybe that's what'll happen. Regardless, I enjoyed season 1 and I'm on board for season 2. This show was clearly made by talented people with a strong understanding of what made the original films special. It's a must-see for fans.

One subplot that kind of disappeared was Robby's blowback from betraying his thug friends. His confrontation with them promised payoff and, presumably, that should've happened this season. Don't get me wrong, the logical end point for Robby's arc this season is a showdown at the All-Valley Tournament, most obviously with Miguel. So in a certain sense, he doesn't need "closure" with his thug friends.

Nevertheless, closure was promised. But not delivered.

That's small potatoes though.

One thing that worked for me in the show is the fight choreography. The fight choreography in the films is okay but nothing to write home about. Obviously the idea was to use more grounded and realistic choreography in the three movies. So I can't knock the philosophy of it too much. But mostly it's done in a fairly pedestrian way.

That's a problem from which the YouTube series suffers. I have no idea what the Robby actor's background is. But he SELLS those moves. His balance looks right, his footwork seems pretty solid, etc. In fact, that's true of all the cast. I have no idea if they trained a bunch for the YouTube show or if most of them are legit martial arts students. But there's no arguing with the end result.

Like you, I enjoyed the lack of a pitched battle between Daniel and Johnny. In fact, I like that Daniel is mostly shown doing kata or expressing the philosophy of Miyagi's karate but without ever really mixing it up with anybody. It fits the sad sack he's sort of become.

The really interesting thing is that Johnny and Daniel each arguably took very different lessons from the events of the season than other did. I, for one, got the distinct idea that Johnny was starting to wonder that he'd created a Frankenstein with the Cobra Kai dojo. Miguel did literally everything Johnny ever trained him to do... but maybe that isn't what Johnny wanted... and it took watching Miguel defeat his own son to figure that out.

Meanwhile, Daniel watched his student get defeated and begins thinking he needs a dojo of his own. But why? It's just a tournament. Luck of the draw. Miguel won. But any other day at any other time, things might've gone differently. Why is Daniel taking this so personally? Daniel says that Johnny isn't a cartoon villain to be defeated... but his actions defy his words.

The other thing, Miyagi could've opened a dojo, trained more students, commodified this ancient discipline for profit and all that. But he affirmatively chose not to do that. Hell, he only trained Daniel reluctantly at first. This begs the question of who the ***k Daniel thinks he is to go against Miyagi's unstated wishes by opening a dojo. And using Miyagi's own property to do it, no less!

Johnny might be starting to regret his decision to open a dojo... and maybe Daniel will ultimately do the same.

You mentioned Kreese and Silver. Going into this, I wondered that the events of TKK2 and 3 might be ignored. But no, Silver got name-checked and goings on with the other are obvious. I like that Cobra Kai isn't leaving anything out. Considering TKK3's reputation, it must have been tempting to disregard that chapter of the story. But Silver's mention, the bonsai trees, Daniel mentioning his business venture with Miyagi, etc, that movie is definitely canon.

I could go on but enough is enough. Point is that this was absolutely worth signing up for YouTube Red. Can't wait for future seasons.

If the new Star Wars movies were doing as good a job honoring their past while building their future, odds are I would be in love with them.

That's a fair point about Robby's friends disappearing. Their absence in the latter part of the season is conspicuous, and there should have been some sort of retaliation for the car park fight. Maybe in season 2 they'll address that. I had a similar issue with Kyler. He doesn't flat out disappear the way Robby's friends did, but his role is reduced to an almost mute background player towards the end of the season, despite him being built up as a major character in earlier episodes. I guess that was meant to illustrate how the balance of power had shifted in the high school, with Kyler being demoted from in-your-face jock to mousy beta male. The subplot about him ruining Samantha's reputation was never quite resolved either. So these are all plot points they can revisit in season 2.

I was wondering about the young actors' martial arts backgrounds too. Did they cast them based on their MA training, or did they train them from the ground up for the series? The martial arts choreography is definitely another of this show's strengths. I love the way the contrast in fighting styles reflects the contrast in philosophies and temperaments.

Cobra Kai karate is obviously the more aggressive discipline. Its practitioners usually begin by proactively closing the distance between themselves and their opponent and launching straight into a pre-emptive attack. "Strike first!" It's mostly fast jabs, elbows and sweeping kicks.


Miyagi-do karate is more passive and typically entails waiting for your opponent to come to you, then blocking/deflecting and counterattacking. It also makes better use of grapple techniques, whereas Cobra Kai karate is 95% strikes. Many of the grapple moves resemble aikido in how they use an opponent's momentum against them.


Cobra Kai karate is all about strength, speed and invasive manoeuvring. Miyagi-do karate is about reflexes, precision and controlling the space around you. Both styles require the practitioner to be in the correct state of mind: for Cobra Kai karate it's a state of aggression and ruthlessness, while for Miyagi-do karate it's a state of calm, focused balance. It's not entirely obvious which style is the more effective, though Cobra Kai karate appears to be easier and quicker to learn. And while it is primarily an offensive style of fighting, it can also make for an effective defence.


However the greatest master of Miyagi-do, Miyagi himself, was able to singlehandedly defeat the top three masters of Cobra Kai at the same time. I don't know if that proves Miyagi-do is the superior discipline, or if it just proves Miyagi himself was the better fighter.


Does anyone know what style of karate the defending champion was using in the Cobra Kai finale? I mean the guy in the blue gi who gave that speech about tolerance (lol). His technique looked more like tricking or capoeira than any form of karate I've seen.

In a related bit of news, Sean Kanan has expressed an interest in reprising his role as Mike Barnes from The Karate Kid: Part III. Judging from its highly positive reception, I think another season of Cobra Kai is inevitable. So Barnes may return after all, provided of course he's no longer trying to take over Metropolis in the name of the Nazi Party.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Mon,  7 May  2018, 22:26However the greatest master of Miyagi-do, Miyagi himself, was able to singlehandedly defeat the top three masters of Cobra Kai at the same time. I don't know if that proves Miyagi-do is the superior discipline, or if it just proves Miyagi himself was the better fighter.

I assume the latter. As an interpretive thing, I guess I always assumed it came down to how well the student embraced the philosophy of his dojo. Daniel held his own against Johnny in TKK1 but only scored a whoppin' one point on Barnes in TKK3... and I assume the reason for that is because Barnes was a lot closer to the Cobra Kai ideal by nature than Johnny ever was on his best day. Cruelty was probably Barnes's most powerful weapon.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Mon,  7 May  2018, 22:26In a related bit of news, Sean Kanan has expressed an interest in reprising his role as Mike Barnes from The Karate Kid: Part III. Judging from its highly positive reception, I think another season of Cobra Kai is inevitable. So Barnes may return after all, provided of course he's no longer trying to take over Metropolis in the name of the Nazi Party.

I really dug that episode of L&C.

But anyway, as far as Kanan is concerned, he'd be welcome in my book. It might be kind of interesting to watch Barnes and Johnny struggle over the Cobra Kai identity: Johnny as the (relatively) kinder, gentler reformer and Barnes as the set-his-hair-on-fire radical, with Kreese in the background doing a Palpatine impersonation.

But honestly, there are probably zillions of directions they could go in at this point.

By a strange coincidence, I just looked up Yuji Okumoto who played Chozen in The Karate Kid: Part II. And to my surprise...


'Chi of Steel' is tied with 'The Phoenix' and 'Tempus Fugitive' as my favourite episode of L&C season 2, but somehow I never realised that was Chozen until now. I guess those glasses really are an effective disguise after all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJKb_3AN0I8

This was a good moment. Johnny wants to put the screws to Daniel a little bit by co-opting his signature move. Miguel does it in the most sarcastic yet effective way that it's a handy reminder that the Cobra Kai philosophy of strike first, strike hard, no mercy, can be turned on and turned off at will. The Crane Technique is an inherently defensive posture. Doing it so well indicates that Miguel chooses to be what he is.

It's a good moment.

I need to check this show out.

I understand John Kreese (Martin Kove) makes a cameo.  Is that right?

What would be cool is if they brought back Sean Kanan, and Thomas Ian Griffith as Terry Silver, who was such a deliciously evil villain in the third film.  I'm not going to pretend that the third film is particularly good, but the almost pantomime levels of villainy are sublime, and since Johnny appears to be a more interesting and complex, even sympathetic, character here, it wouldn't hurt to add some more unequivocal villains.

One of the things that's best about the show is the response to it. I figured there would be some attention paid but the acclaim has been really incredible. I don't think even the creators of the show were necessarily banking on this level of good will. Because if they were, they'd have to be fools.

It looks like this show found its audience pretty much right from the start. Which isn't very common. Or very easy to do.

Quote from: johnnygobbs on Mon, 14 May  2018, 10:16
What would be cool is if they brought back Sean Kanan, and Thomas Ian Griffith as Terry Silver, who was such a deliciously evil villain in the third film.  I'm not going to pretend that the third film is particularly good, but the almost pantomime levels of villainy are sublime, and since Johnny appears to be a more interesting and complex, even sympathetic, character here, it wouldn't hurt to add some more unequivocal villains.

Sean Kanan has said he's reprising his role as Mike Barnes in season 2.


Thomas Ian Griffith has retired from acting and is currently a producer on the TV series Grimm. But it'd be swell if they could lure him back as Terry Silver.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Mon, 14 May  2018, 21:58
One of the things that's best about the show is the response to it. I figured there would be some attention paid but the acclaim has been really incredible. I don't think even the creators of the show were necessarily banking on this level of good will. Because if they were, they'd have to be fools.

It looks like this show found its audience pretty much right from the start. Which isn't very common. Or very easy to do.

The response has been great. I've seen countless comments comparing it to Ghostbusters 2016, Star Wars and all the other classic film properties that have been soiled by lousy reboots in the last few years. The consensus is that Cobra Kai gets it right – it treats the originals with respect without being a retread; it references classic characters and moments from the old films without getting bogged down in fan service; it tells an original story and takes the characters in fresh directions they've not gone before.

Lately we've seen so many IPs rebooted in ways that alienated large portions of the fan base. But Cobra Kai feels like it belongs to the fans. While Star Wars is drowning at the hands of Kathleen Kennedy, the popularity of the Karate Kid franchise is only increasing.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Wed, 16 May  2018, 21:41Lately we've seen so many IPs rebooted in ways that alienated large portions of the fan base. But Cobra Kai feels like it belongs to the fans. While Star Wars is drowning at the hands of Kathleen Kennedy, the popularity of the Karate Kid franchise is only increasing.

Yep. The common element here is people saying that this new thing doesn't seem like a big F You to the original audience like those newer properties are.

One reason this is so mind-blowing for me is because TKK didn't have very many people publicly declaring their love for the property before Cobra Kai came along. If anything, TKK3 and the remake left some stink on the franchise. The attitude seemed to be that the first two are good but everything else is p00p.

I've seen fewer people arguing that now. Suddenly it's becoming okay for people to say "Ya know, I rather enjoy the entire TKK trilogy".

It makes me wonder what might have been if Return Of The Jedi had been the end of Star Wars until 2015. No Special Editions, no 90's renaissance, no prequels, nothing. But then in 2012 Lucas announces a sequel trilogy which continues the story while honoring everything that came before, after which he was retiring.

Under those circumstances, I think the Star Wars brand might be overall less profitable but more cherished as a result. It would be starting off where Planet Of The Apes was prior to those new movies where people who remember it love it but not necessarily everyone does remember it.

Anyway, the sheer GOOD WILL that Cobra Kai has stirred up is enjoyable. It proves that fans aren't necessarily out to pick on everything and everybody; they simply want quality stuff and they'll be your biggest advocates if you give it to them.

Never thought I'd see the day when the KK franchise is more highly respected than Star Wars. But here we are. It is indeed a disturbing universe.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Wed, 16 May  2018, 23:53
Never thought I'd see the day when the KK franchise is more highly respected than Star Wars. But here we are. It is indeed a disturbing universe.

Strange, isn't it? The Karate Kid's prestige has skyrocketed as a result of this show. According to Parrot Analytics, Cobra Kai outperformed every other VOD TV series last week, getting more views than any show on Hulu, Netflix or any other streaming service:
http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/cobra-kai-youtube-red-karate-kid-1202810780/


It's currently got a 9.1 rating on the IMDb and a 98% positive Google user rating. Meanwhile the IMDb has disabled the user ratings for Solo after they sank into the 5-6/10 range. One of these productions clearly has the unanimous support of the fans while the other doesn't.

So I just discovered certain comments Kanan made during 2016. If you know what I mean.

And let's just say I respect him now more than ever.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Sat,  2 Jun  2018, 02:20
So I just discovered certain comments Kanan made during 2016. If you know what I mean.

And let's just say I respect him now more than ever.

Is Sean Kanan aware how much his ethnic group is hated by a large number of the other people who expressed similar comments in 2016? If you know what I mean.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l13DPHHTTcc

Interesting analysis of Chozen vs "Bad Boy" Mike Barnes. Hell, I was thinking Mike Barnes, but after watching that video, I'm not quite as sure as I was before...

"Cobra Kai Season One" was outstanding! Especially in this day and age when it comes to classic franchises. Definitely looking forward to Season 2. Larusso, Lawrence, Kreese, Barnes ... yeah Season Two can't get here soon enough!

Chozen v Barnes?

Barnes, all the way and back. Chozen was ultimately vanquished by Daniel. They both gave as good as they got but it was a decisive win for Daniel.

Barnes consistently dominated Daniel. There was never a point when Daniel was capable of hanging with Barnes. Daniel centered himself with kata and SCORED ONE POINT, thereby winning the tournament. That's it! Daniel landed a punch on Barnes.

Daniel utterly destroyed Chozen.

Barnes would lay waste to Chozen without breaking too much of a sweat.

That YouTube guy is WAY off.

Course, the easy rebuttal is you could always throw in a scenario, since this is a "what if" at best, is what if Daniel centered himself and became confident in his abilities thru kata RIGHT FROM THE START with Barnes, rather than continually give in to his emotions throughout the match? Would the All Valley Karate Championship point system match between the two have fared any different? Yeah, I think the possibility would be VERY likely.

With the Daniel vs Chozen fight to the death, which ended up not being a match to the death, it's evident Chozen was an absolute mess emotionally before he even made his rather flashy appearance for the fight. Embarrassed and dishonored, Chozen's motivation in publicly challenging Daniel to a fight to the death was all that he could do, in his mind, to save face. Factor in addition, everyone, and it appeared to be EVERYONE at the festival, putting their support behind Daniel, and the idea of Chozen being increasingly wrecked even during the fight is probable. Hell, I would say Chozen was more wrecked during his fight with Daniel, than Daniel was with his point system match with Mike Barnes. Each emotional factor with each played a role in their respective matches for sure, and it's interesting to think how different those matches would have been since you just know that their opponents consciously, or unconsciously took advantage.

Course this is all idle speculation, and fun to think about, but I think the guy in the video has a strong and valid point in Miyagi Do karate being ultimately superior than Cobra Kai karate. Daniel Larusso went from an out of town chump, to defeating the baddest kid in the high school within one year. Never mind Miyagi always making short work of Kreese the couple of times they squared off, along with throwing Mike Barnes around like a wet noodle. Terry Silver? Yeah, that "Quicksilver" method didn't seem to move the ball either against Miyagi Do karate either. I would hate to have seen what Sato would have done in that situation. Actually, no. I would have loved to have seen that. Sato probably would have destroyed the Cobra Kai dojo like the incredible hulk. It would have been hilarious.

Course if it's decided to bring back Chozen and add him to the cast for Season 3, where somewhere along the way there's a Mike Barnes vs Chozen fight to answer this what if definitively, that would be cool. Barnes was clearly one bad MF'er, but nope. I'm not entirely convinced that he would have defeated a clear headed, Miyagi Do trained, Chozen. I will say this, the writers, going off of Season One, seem to be very capable with handling the continuity, and actually care about the material rather than pushing lib agendas like so many shows do these days. I dig familiar faces when it comes to this stuff. I noticed Tamlyn Tomita (Kumiko) has aged pretty well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_Q53rxghZM&t=129s

Season 2 coming April 24th.

Looking good. And then tension with Johnny continues. Daniel is offering to train students for free, which is a clear shot across the bow at Johnny.

And, frankly, I don't think Mr. Miyagi would approve of Daniel teaching random strangers. He certainly wouldn't approve of doing it just to get under a rival's skin.

Daniel may be walking the path again but his motives are anything but pure.

I hope this all intentional and that my interpretation of these developments matches their intent. Because there's a chance that Daniel is being presented to the audience as noble when, in all honesty, I see nothing noble whatsoever in what it looks like he'll be doing in season 02. And that's not a criticism. It's good writing (assuming I'm right).

Yes. Looking forward to release day.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3p1fHBNILhM

"He won't know what hit him."

Daniel looks about as horrified as he should. Is he teaching the right lessons? And how pure are his motives anyway?

This show isn't a nostalgia trip and it isn't taking the easy way out on anything. Incredibly great stuff here, can't wait.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu,  4 Apr  2019, 17:52

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VaXoQJx3jYs

This thing is riding a gravy train with biscuit wheels and I just love it.

Philosophically, I subscribe to the idea of cycles of violence. One act of violence begets another. It's difficult to break and I adore the honesty of Daniel and Johnny's rivalry continuing into the current day and spilling out onto others. Obviously Kreese isn't a passive observer in all this but whatever.

There's almost nothing about this show that doesn't work for me in a big way.

Season 2 Episode 1: "Mercy Part 2" is available now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKc-SxD0HZE

Here are my thoughts on season 2. This post contains spoilers, so don't read unless you've watched the whole thing.

I enjoyed the first half of the season a lot. There was a hefty dose of fan service Easter eggs in the first episode, but that offered a soft re-entry point to ease viewers back into the storyline. The emphasis on character remains as prominent as in the first season and continues to be one of the show's greatest strengths. The line between hero and villain also remains as indistinct as it was in the previous season. Johnny's speech to his students about how life isn't black and white perfectly encapsulates the writers' attitude towards their protagonists. No one is all good or all bad. Except maybe Kreese.

The standout performance is once again William Zabka's. He nails the comedic aspects of the material, but also imbues Johnny with the perfect amount of vulnerability to evoke pathos without ever going overboard or feeling inconsistent with the pre-established characterisation. Johnny Lawrence is rapidly evolving into the franchise's most fascinating character since Miyagi. Macchio and Kove also deserve praise and both are on top form here. There are several moments where Kreese comes dangerously close to having a sympathetic side. But in the end you realise he's more evil than ever. He's one of the most popular movie villains of the eighties and it's good to see his malign nature hasn't mellowed with age.

One of the central themes in the Karate Kid franchise has always been masculinity and the role father figures play in guiding young boys towards becoming grown men. Both the movies and the TV show present us with characters whose potentials are shaped by their mentors, for better or for worse. The inclusion of Kreese in the second season adds a whole new level of bad influence for the younger characters. Even Johnny, now in his middle age, is still under the influence of his former sensei; at first heeding his bad advice, and later trying to avoid it. In light of the ongoing pathologisation of masculinity, it's more important than ever for boys to have good male role models. And Cobra Kai doesn't shy away from addressing this issue. It may not be a popular subject, but it is a timely one and the series handles it well.

Moving on to the negative, I think the second half of the season is where cracks start to emerge. For one thing, there's just too much repetition. In some cases it's repetition of things from the previous season, like Daniel and Johnny bonding over a drink only to immediately fall out again the very next day. In other cases the repetition stems from scenarios that are simply overused in this season. How many times did antagonistic couples awkwardly bump into each other while out on a date? How many times did Cobra Kai students bump into Miyagi-Do students and give each other the death stare? By the end of the season some of these routines felt badly played out. My memory may be playing tricks on me, but I also remember the fight choreography being better in the first season. Some of the fighting in the new episodes was a bit sloppy, though most of it was decent.

There were one or two points in the second half of the season where the ordinarily strong writing descended into the sort of idiot plot territory you'd expect from a regular soap. For instance, the part where Robby lies about Miyagi's medal, or where he takes Sam to his dad's house without letting her parents know she's ok. Anyone could see that wasn't going to end well. Or the part where Sam allows herself to be baited into a drinking contest by Tory, despite promising her mother she'd make good decisions earlier in the same episode. As soon as that conversation took place, I knew Sam was going to do something dumb. Then she caps it off by succumbing to the old soap cliché of kissing her ex-boyfriend after downing one too many drinks. And the only reason she did this, from a dramatic standpoint, was to facilitate the conflict in the final episode. The season finale wouldn't have had a big set piece if the characters had behaved intelligently. Sam even says to Robby:

"I feel like an idiot. We should have just gone to my house and been honest with my parents."

Well duh. This almost felt like the writers acknowledging their concession to idiot plot mechanics, but I doubt that's what they intended. It's one thing for characters to make believable errors that reveal their human weakness; it's another thing for them to make dumb mistakes you can see coming from a mile away in situations where they should really know better. So while the writing is generally very good in this show, particularly regarding the treatment of character, I do think the quality dipped a little towards the end of the second season. But this mostly just applies to the last three or four episodes. The writing in the first half of the season was mostly excellent.

To conclude, I liked season 2 but I didn't think it was quite as strong as the first season. It's not a sophomore slump, but it also doesn't feel quite as fresh the second time around. Cobra Kai is at its best when it focuses on the adult characters, interlaces humour with drama, and satirises the absurdities of 21st century PC culture. It's at its worst when it overindulges the teen soap opera angle, relies too heavily on formulaic confrontations, and derives predictable melodrama from idiot plot-induced misunderstandings that could easily be avoided with common sense. The first season was excellent. The second season is good. But I'm starting to think this concept works best as a limited thing. Is there enough juice left in the can for a third season? Presumably Johnny's going to team up with Daniel to take down Kreese. And surely Ali's got to return. They've teased her comeback for two seasons now and I imagine she and Johnny will eventually get back together. Or would that be too predictable? Whatever happens, I'll be tuning in for season 3.

************* SPOILERS ABOUND

Literally just finished season 02 and it's nice to know that I'm not the only one who had some reservations about the back half of it. The PC thing... there's a moment where it's almost like someone involved with the show realized how little of that there was in the first season so they tried to correct things a bit in this season.

I view the fight choreography as starting off this season well enough and then getting noticeably worse with each subsequent episode. Maybe it's to be expected. After all, it's obvious that the character were cast based on acting abilities rather than fighting prowess. Some of them have such distinct body types that it's not easy (or cost efficient) to find fighting doubles for them.

That means the cast does a lot of their own fighting. Robby handles his fight scenes like a champ, mainly. I'd say his work in season 02 is about even with his work from season 01. Which is to say, noticeably good. Kid's got skills, no doubts there.

Sam... idk. Her skills were hit and miss. For that matter, so were Daniel's.

The worst of the big characters was probably Tory. She was definitely cast, I think, based on her acting chops. She brings serious pathos and drama to her scenes. I can't knock her performance on really any level. She's a solid actress and even though she's a villain, she carries dignity and no small amount of believable sympathy in her scenes.

But let's face it, she's not a terribly great martial artist. I wouldn't say she's as awkward and clumsy as Sarah Michelle Gellar. But she's nothing to write home about either. She seems to do her best fighting with moves that involve spins or lots of footwork. But the fundamentals of how to throw punches or kicks... less so. In fact, I'll go out on a limb and suggest to you that Tory's school of choice probably shouldn't be karate. Judo, Aikido or other schools might be a better match for her skills and balance.

Speaking of balance, I enjoyed Daniel and his wife's chemistry and marriage in the first part of the season. It's so refreshing to see a normal, healthy marriage in a show anymore. So when their storyline kicked in, it really hit me the way it should've.

Then again, it could be a personal thing for me since I'm getting married in about a week. Shall we toss a coin on this?

One thing I'll give this finale a crap ton of credit for is how it played me like a fiddle. "Oh yeah, as if. Adults would break this up real quick. Good thing too because it would be just a matter of time irl until someone really gets his head cracked open or something. Somebody would get hurt with something a lot worse than a bloody nose or split lip if this happened for real. But these kids are using kids gloves because we all know this show isn't going there."

And then this show went there. I was genuinely, truly, deeply shocked.

And honestly, this business with Miguel is a positive thing. I don't need my entertainment to be preachy. In fact, I prefer it when my entertainment allows me to make my own moral judgments. But facts is facts. (1) This entire rivalry was getting out of control last season and (2) this isn't a game and when people fight in real life, it's with real strikes that draw real blood. So often, movies and shows ignore the consequences of violence. And I'll even say it's okay to do that for entertainment purposes.

But the reality is that Daniel isn't a creative enough thinker to imagine a way to end the rivalry in a peaceful way. Maybe I'm overthinking it but my view is that Miyagi would be uniquely horrified by most of Daniel's actions in this show. The entire reason Miyagi issued the challenge to Kreese to face off in the tournament (where conditions can be controlled) was precisely because he didn't want this grudge to boil over irl (where conditions can't be controlled).

Miyagi would've found a way to minimize or even avoid violence entirely. Daniel can't because, I think, he's a lesser man. Miyagi could've trained students whenever he wanted to. He chose not to because this is a discipline; not a sport. Daniel allowed himself to get swallowed up in the Cobra Kai rivalry and now people have gotten hurt badly.

Cobra Kai, the show, is almost a postmortem character study of why Miyagi really had his crap together in all three of the movies. Daniel has never truly known when it's time to walk away. Or better still, to sue for peace.

Now yes, if Daniel successfully sues for peace, there's no show. I get that. I'm just saying that none of this stuff would've happened if Miyagi had been calling the shots. When Miyagi said that fighting is the last resort, this entire show is what he meant and it's everything he tried to avoid.

Is season 02 better than the first? Come on. But the first season set the bar ridiculously high and I'll give this season credit. It didn't shy away from paying off the promises that were made in the first season. I can sit here all day long picking apart this fight scene or that subplot. But at the end of the day, season 01 accrued certain narrative debts. And season 02 began paying off those narrative debts.

I can't ask for anything more than that.

But seriously, Tory needs to work on her karate or something. Great actress though.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Thu, 25 Apr  2019, 22:56That means the cast does a lot of their own fighting. Robby handles his fight scenes like a champ, mainly. I'd say his work in season 02 is about even with his work from season 01. Which is to say, noticeably good. Kid's got skills, no doubts there.

Sam... idk. Her skills were hit and miss. For that matter, so were Daniel's.

Of the younger cast members, the actors who play Robby and Miguel strike me as the most convincing fighters. I wouldn't be surprised if either of them had already trained prior to the show. I cut Macchio some slack since he's turning 58 this year, and for a guy who's pushing 60 he looks great for his age. But some of his moves were lacking this season. The scene where he rescues Robby on the beach looked particularly awkward in places. It reminded me of some of David Carradine's fight scenes.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Thu, 25 Apr  2019, 22:56And honestly, this business with Miguel is a positive thing. I don't need my entertainment to be preachy. In fact, I prefer it when my entertainment allows me to make my own moral judgments. But facts is facts. (1) This entire rivalry was getting out of control last season and (2) this isn't a game and when people fight in real life, it's with real strikes that draw real blood. So often, movies and shows ignore the consequences of violence. And I'll even say it's okay to do that for entertainment purposes.

Surely he'd be paralysed after a fall like that. Unless they send him to the same doctor that treated Bullseye at the end of DD s3, Miguel's going to have a rough time ahead of him. He's a good kid and is my favourite of the younger characters, so I'm sorry to see him end up like that. But I respect the writers for having the guts to take his arc in such a harrowing direction. I'm expecting his storyline in season 3 to resemble Jason Street's character arc in the first season of Friday Night Lights. It's going to be intense.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Thu, 25 Apr  2019, 22:56Miyagi would've found a way to minimize or even avoid violence entirely. Daniel can't because, I think, he's a lesser man. Miyagi could've trained students whenever he wanted to. He chose not to because this is a discipline; not a sport. Daniel allowed himself to get swallowed up in the Cobra Kai rivalry and now people have gotten hurt badly.

All throughout the school fight I was thinking to myself, "What would Miyagi think if he could see this?" He'd have been so disappointed at how badly Daniel's screwed up.


Obviously Daniel can't take all the blame for what Robby did, but he and Johnny are directly responsible for the conflict which led to that fight. Neither of them can sort this mess out on their own, but if they put their heads together they just might be able to fix things. In order to do that they'll have to grow up, put the kids' interests first and start focusing on who their real enemy is.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Thu, 25 Apr  2019, 22:56Then again, it could be a personal thing for me since I'm getting married in about a week. Shall we toss a coin on this?

That's awesome! Congratulations! :) I formally grant you permission to take some time away from the site, provided you return at some point to discuss the new Tolkien biopic.

Cobra Kai has been renewed for a third season.

https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/cobra-kai-renewed-season-3-youtube-premium-1203183186/

Yes, congrats to Colors on getting married!


As far as Cobra Kai Season 2 goes, I finally checked this out last week. 4th of July marathon. I'll parrot what's already been stated, and agree that S2 was simply not quite as strong as S1, but it was entertaining nevertheless. Truth be told, I was expecting to see Mike Barnes at some point, but having now seen S2, it's pretty evident that his return would have been premature with the storylines S2 wanted to tell. if we're talking villains, this was definitely Kreese's season in reasserting himself as the major villain of the Karate Kid universe. Having said that, I am actually glad Barnes wasn't in S2. Course there's always S3 for that. With what happened to Miguel, I kinda wonder if this leaves the door open to a possible return to Okinawa? It's evident that Daniel never learned the pain suppression technique from Miyagi from S1, and this technique, if Daniel finally learns it, which would only be because of his ties to Miyagi himself and maybe the memories of the people from the events from KK2, could ideally help aid Miguel in his long road to recovery.

Don't really have a whole lot to add that hasn't already been stated.

I'm open to Barnes returning. Cobra Kai needs a new sensei. Kreese is back so it has a sempai. But it with Johnny seemingly out of the picture, there needs to be a sensei. In a certain sense, Barnes is the logical choice. Or a logical choice anyway.

From a creative standpoint, there are so many direction season 03 can go in. I said before that season 01 accumulated certain narrative debts and season 02 began paying some of those debts off. Well, season 02 also introduced some narrative debts of its own that season 03 has to address. Tons of potential going on here.

I'm really stoked about where this thing could go.

New article pertaining to Season 3.

https://ew.com/comic-con/2019/07/18/cobra-kai-season-3-ralph-macchio-okinawa/

Evidently, a return to Okinawa is happening.

The series needs something to shake things up a bit, and the trip to Okinawa might just do it.

It's also been announced that a new comic is coming out later this year titled Cobra Kai: The Karate Kid Saga Continues: https://www.slashfilm.com/cobra-kai-comic-book/

I have to say, all these years later and the Karate Kid franchise is riding on a gravy train with biscuit wheels. Wouldn't have predicted this even a few years ago. But the affection people still have for this material combined with the story potential it obviously still has (and is exploring) is truly impressive.

From such humble beginnings...

Some sad news. Rob Garrison, who played Tommy in the Karate Kid films and Cobra Kai season 2, has died from cancer at the age of 59.

https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/rob-garrison-dies-dead-karate-kid-1203352113/

I had no idea he was sick in real life. This makes his final scenes in CK season 2 all the more poignant.

The campfire stuff was the first thing I thought about too. So sad. I also had no idea he was sick irl. Prayers for him and his family.

R.I.P.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fq-L8vxE8XY

We're getting a physical media release of Seasons 1 & 2.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71LtN-VU5XL._SL1291_.jpg)

Quote from: The Joker on Thu,  3 Oct  2019, 01:18

We're getting a physical media release of Seasons 1 & 2.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/71LtN-VU5XL._SL1291_.jpg)

Now that's... interesting. A bit unexpected, really. Guess I thought the market for physical media had evaporated so much that there'd be no real demand for something like this.

But hey...

Cobra Kai is moving to Netflix: https://variety.com/2020/tv/news/cobra-kai-netflix-season-3-1234644542/

A quality interview with Sean "Mike Barnes" Kanan. Discussing how he got the role of Mike Barnes in Karate Kid III, behind the scenes stories, his serious injury that resulted in surgery and a hospital stay, and what he thinks happened to Mike Barnes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aI79eh0DXJo

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Mon, 22 Jun  2020, 20:43
Cobra Kai is moving to Netflix: https://variety.com/2020/tv/news/cobra-kai-netflix-season-3-1234644542/

I'm fine with that. I was getting tired of creating new Google accounts for free trials of YouTube Red or whatever it's called these days.

There's a very brief preview of season 3 right at the end of this vid.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 27 Aug  2020, 16:47
There's a very brief preview of season 3 right at the end of this vid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLpyi-oVoIY

Are we assuming that the guy who sweeps Daniel and stabs with the sai is Chozen? Idk who else it could be.

It has to be Chozen.

I can't imagine Daniel returning to Okinawa and not have Chozen and/or Kumiko return. Especially so with each season giving us familiar faces, along with the new.

Maybe it's only me, but the ending of season 1 reminded me a bit of the Joker reveal from Batman.

(https://i.ibb.co/D4W1978/cobra-kai.jpg)

Good call.

Quote from: Azrael on Sun, 20 Sep  2020, 21:28
Maybe it's only me, but the ending of season 1 reminded me a bit of the Joker reveal from Batman.

(https://i.ibb.co/D4W1978/cobra-kai.jpg)

I hadn't actually noticed this, but when you lay the shots out like that the two scenes do strongly resemble one another. Perhaps it was a deliberate homage?

Quote from: The Joker on Mon, 21 Sep  2020, 01:25
Good call.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Wed, 23 Sep  2020, 12:25
I hadn't actually noticed this, but when you lay the shots out like that the two scenes do strongly resemble one another. Perhaps it was a deliberate homage?

I watched S01 a while ago. When I noticed I searched interviews, fan discussions (in reddit etc), including the Cobra Kai discussion in this forum, didn't find anyone mentioning anything so I left it at that, no point in me appearing even more crazy. There's no official word on this being a homage but, have to admit, there is a similarity there (even watching the videos side by side).

Fall down a two story building, land on your back and... you're paralyzed for life, sorry. But at least the showrunners aren't running away from season 02. And more power to 'em for that.

I'm rly looking forward to this. Kreese is back and there's Kumiko, Chozen and maybe more. I guess Barnes is season 04?

Daniel sounds like he's suing for peace. Y'know, what he should've done back in season 01? Good on him for getting there in the end.

Are there four factions now? Or only three? You've got Cobra Kai led by Kreese, Johnny and Miguel, Miyagi-do led by Daniel and... Chozen? I mean, Chozen never came off like much of a joiner to me so I can't picture him aligning with Kreese.

Again, maybe I'm projecting depth where it's not intended. But this is the price of violence, even if it's self-defense. The cycle of violence keeps going and going. That was a consistent theme in the films and I say good on the showrunners and writers for picking that up back in season 01 and playing things out logically.

Can't wait. Cobra Kai Season 1 was such a pleasant surprise. Season 2 was a bit of a step down, but I'm still looking forward to this. Nice to see Danny and Johnny putting their differences aside to help others.

Man, this is going to be an interesting season.

Having Daniel going back to Okinawa, following the deaths of Miyagi and Sato, after so many years should be compelling. Especially in terms of reuniting Kumiko. Which I felt was much more of a actual romance for Daniel than Ali in KK1. Which came across more like simple infatuation/puppy love. In addition to finding out where Chozen's path went post-Karate Kid 2. Evidently, he never left Okinawa, or didn't stray too far away, so it's possible he might have made amends with his Uncle Sato at some point. Or did their relationship remained strained?

Also, the idea of both Daniel and Chozen leading Miyagi-do could get entertaining very quickly. Unlike the time where both Johnny and Kreese led Cobra-Kai in Season 2, there might not be any hidden agendas/schemes between Daniel/Chozen, except for a obvious distain for one another (and probably much more externally on Chozen's end). And perhaps Chozen having a need to be present during Miyagi-do training, as he feels Daniel isn't bringing enough 'honor' to Miyagi-do teachings.

Maybe we'll get that Mike Barnes cameo at the end of this season? He's one of those character's we've been anticipating the return of for awhile now, but I'm glad the series is taking it's time in having familiar faces return.

By the by...

Are we talking odds on Miguel being Terry Silver's son? Or Barnes's?

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Fri, 11 Dec  2020, 04:43
By the by...

Are we talking odds on Miguel being Terry Silver's son? Or Barnes's?

How can that be? Miguel's Hispanic, and he doesn't look mixed to me. Also, why would Silver's son be in Reseda?

Quote from: BatmanFurst on Fri, 11 Dec  2020, 05:03

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Fri, 11 Dec  2020, 04:43
By the by...

Are we talking odds on Miguel being Terry Silver's son? Or Barnes's?

How can that be? Miguel's Hispanic, and he doesn't look mixed to me. Also, why would Silver's son be in Reseda?

Rashida Jones is half-African American but most people wouldn't know that by looking at her. Point being that sometimes a mixed-race person doesn't look mixed-race.

Now that I think about it tho, Silver is possibly too old to be Miguel's father. Maybe.

I didn't think it was coming out so soon. But January 1st it is. That'll give us all something to watch over the second half of Christmas. :)

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 24 Dec  2020, 16:18

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9knMpi2tans

I didn't think it was coming out so soon. But January 1st it is. That'll give us all something to watch over the second half of Christmas. :)

I can roll with that date. Pleasant surprise. I've been pretty stoked for season 03 so this works for me.

"BS, I heard you were the real bully!"

Heh, glad somebody acknowledged that.

Spoiler alert. Read the next stuff at your own risk.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Fri,  1 Jan  2021, 19:22
"BS, I heard you were the real bully!"

Heh, glad somebody acknowledged that.

Finished the season. First time I've binged an entire season of something all in one day. Weird but here we are.

For openers, I kind of enjoyed how the various rivalries and factions invert the usual high school hierarchy. One thing I discovered near the end of high school is just how fragile the hierarchy truly is. I have no idea what it's like these days but in my day, people who weren't part of the in-crowd were expected to stay away from them. And vice versa. Social currency mattered greatly to most kids my age. But the events of the first two seasons haven't happened in a vacuum. The end result of that stuff, especially the massive brawl near the end of season 02, is that the gravity is being heavily warped in the high school. Kids are making friends and associations (by choice and by necessity) that have greatly distorted the social ecosystem and that has a deep plausibility to it. For me, anyway, Ymmv.

Backstory on Kreese. In itself, it's quite good. But the actor playing Terry Silver looks, um, basically nothing like Terry Silver. By itself, that's not the end of the world. Except the other Special Forces operative looks a LOT like Silver. Same weird face, same ponytail, same everything. But nope, the other guy is Silver. Because reasons. It's weird and distracting. I liked Kreese's backstory, don't get me wrong. But the business related to Silver was just so bizarre that I don't understand how or why it was allowed to happen.

The consequences of violence has been the main franchise of this show for me. We all bring our own baggage to the table. An acquired aversion to irl violence as much as possible is my baggage. I'm from the school of violence only as self-defense and only as a truly last resort. When the only alternative is death. Because cycles of violence are absolutely real and once the snowball starts rolling down the hill, there's no saying how things will turn out.

The business with Chozen... well, let's talk about that. Episode 04 features the return of Chozen. The last ten seconds or so were predictable enough. Then again, Chozen's return was spoiled early. Still, Chozen's character arc does seem to conflict with Cobra Kai's theme of "cycles of violence never end". But I don't think his more pacifistic ways and forgiving nature challenge that theme so much as reinforce it. Chozen is the guy who should bear one hell of a grudge against Daniel. But Sato got to him. Sato's life wasn't in vain after all. Sato was able to impart the most important lesson he ever learned to Chozen: the value of forgiveness. As a result, Chozen taught Daniel very important lessons that probably enabled him to survive the finale.

Chozen and the bell girl from KK2 both embody the values of mercy and forgiveness. Chozen indirectly saved Daniel's life. The KK2 bell girl directly saved his business.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say that for Daniel's participation, Cobra Kai season 03 is very much a sequel to KK2 from the standpoint that Daniel revisits so many of those characters, themes and conflicts from a more mature, grown-up point of view.

The return of Ali. Yeah, we all knew it would come to that in the end. Her purpose is basically shining a light on the value of nostalgia. Nostalgia is fine in its place. But it's still worth remembering that we sometimes adopt a rose-colored view of things. Daniel and Johnny both idealized their relationships with Ali. Here, for a change, we get her perspective. And ultimately, it's not too important. They were kids! And they did kid things in a kid time in a kid way. The past is prologue; move along.

Johnny vs. Kreese. It went just about the way I thought it would. I always figured if Kreese and Johnny ever truly came to blows, Kreese would crush him. Johnny put up more of a fight than I'd expected, and arguably won until Kreese took a cheap shot. But like the mythical snake, Johnny always knew Kreese's true nature. For Kreese, that wasn't a cheap shot. It's just winning. Very good for character.

Daniel vs. Kreese. Same thing, in a way. If they'd squared off before Daniel had a chance to reunite with Chozen, I don't see how Daniel wins. But win, Daniel does. The look he trades with Johnny is just perfect. "This is your time, this is your moment, this is your kill". Johnny might've wanted Kreese for himself but I think Daniel had a just plain better claim. Kreese sent the Cobra Kais to Daniel's house. Who knows how badly out of control that could've gotten? The law aside, Daniel had a moral right to end Kreese right then and there. It is a strange irony that Samantha inadvertently saved Kreese's life after he had deliberately endangered hers.

The perfection of those moments is enough to make me overlook the plotholes going on there. How did Daniel know to find Kreese at the dojo at that time of night? How did Sam know what her father would do and find him there? It's easy to make educated guesses as to how all that came about but we never see it. So, technically, those are plotholes. But I don't rly care. Esp when filling in those plotholes would've destroyed the rhythm of the finale.

Finally, the post-mortem character development for Mr. Miyagi continues. It's clear that Miyagi truly was deadly. Miyagi taught Daniel everything Daniel knew. But it's crystal clear that Miyagi never taught Daniel everything Miyagi himself knew. Which adds up. He wanted Daniel to be able to defend himself. And Daniel can. At least nine out of ten people in the world are probably no match for Daniel in his prime.

But teaching the offensive killing arts would logically be something that Miyagi would refuse to do. He served in the war and probably dealt out more death than he cared to remember. Miyagi would have no taste for teaching others to kill. He did his duty in the service. And that's fine. But I think Miyagi would've wanted to killing behind forever once the war ended.

Plus, on a selfish level, I imagine that Miyagi believed that adding offensive maneuvers intended to kill diluted the moral and philosophical purity of his karate. In teaching Daniel only defensive moves, he ensured that Daniel would never be able to misuse his abilities.

All in all, season 03 is highly enjoyable. I'd say it's more Daniel's season than the previous two. Whether that's good or bad is up to you.

Thanks for posting that review, Colors.

Sounds like a pretty good season, but that Terry Silver stuff sounds incredibly frustrating. I take it that Thomas Ian Griffith didn't want to return anymore than Chad McQueen did for Season 2. That's disappointing. Anything on Mike Barnes this season?

Quote from: The Joker on Sat,  2 Jan  2021, 04:25Sounds like a pretty good season, but that Terry Silver stuff sounds incredibly frustrating. I take it that Thomas Ian Griffith didn't want to return

The sequence involving Silver took place in probably 1970 or 1971. So, obviously they needed to cast younger actors and Griffith wouldn't have been appropriate for that. Just saying that the actors who were chosen for that sequence were a bit wonky.

Quote from: The Joker on Sat,  2 Jan  2021, 04:25anymore than Chad McQueen did for Season 2.

He didn't want to come back? Never heard about that.

Quote from: The Joker on Sat,  2 Jan  2021, 04:25Anything on Mike Barnes this season?

Nope. But the return of Terry Silver got teased this season a lot like the return of Ali got teased last season. So there's that.

Somewhere along the line, I got the idea that Sean Kanan would be up for coming back. So I wouldn't be too surprised if that's held back for season 05 or something. In fact, five seasons would be a pretty good run for this show. No idea how likely that is but five sounds good.

Ah, ok. For some reason I took it as you meaning Silver returned in the present day, but played by a different actor. I get what you're saying now.

QuoteHe didn't want to come back? Never heard about that.

Yeah, Martin Kove made an honest attempt in getting him back for that Cobra Kai reunion episode with a dying Tommy, and Chad just wasn't interested. So as a consequence, we got the line about Dutch still currently serving time in prison.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35E0nm95MOg

Bummer about Barnes still being MIA, but as you said, that's a character that can be teased for a Season 5. Always leave us wanting more.

I've retitled this thread since the show's no longer exclusive to YouTube.

I finished season 3 earlier today. A channel here in the UK has been repeating the original Karate Kid movie trilogy over Christmas (btw, merry Christmas and happy New Year everyone!), and after rewatching Parts II and III I was ready for more Cobra Kai. Overall, I enjoyed the new season a lot. I didn't think it was quite as fresh or funny as season 1, but it was still very good and was an improvement over season 2. My biggest gripe with season 2 was that it repeated too many plot beats from the first season and didn't break enough new ground. By contrast, season 3 forges ahead with scenarios that Daniel and Johnny have never encountered before (e.g. Robby's struggles in the juvenile detention centre, or Miguel undergoing surgery and having to learn to walk again). I was worried the show might become too formulaic after the repetition in the second season, but season 3 has given me hope for its longevity.

Robby's storyline started off interesting, but became a tad predictable once he got out of juvie. I knew he was going to walk in on Sam and Miguel when they were sparring in the garden, and I knew he was going to end up with Kreese. There also wasn't much closure to the storyline about that bully he kept fighting in juvie. Maybe they'll come back to that character in the next season and have him and his cronies join Robby at Cobra Kai, but as things currently stand that subplot didn't really go anywhere. It felt like it was just there to give Robby something to do while he was locked up.

I found myself losing a lot of sympathy for Robby this season. He screwed up big time in the second season finale, but spent the whole of season 3 blaming other people for what happened. Johnny and Daniel were right to take responsibility for their part in it, but Robby needed to face up to the consequences of his actions too and deal with them instead of constantly running away. I was also surprised to see how eager he was to fight Miguel again. The poor kid was barely out of his wheelchair, yet Robby was ready to attack him all over again. He didn't even apologise for crippling him during their previous encounter. I felt he should have shown more remorse and a reluctance to fight in that scene.

Miguel remains my favourite of the young characters. The speed of his recovery was a bit ridiculous, but it fit the over-the-top style of the show. I was happy to see him back on his feet, though a little disturbed by how often the Cobra Kai gang kept laying into him. He was recovering from serious surgery and lucky to be walking again, and yet the other kids kept pummelling him with kidney blows and never cut him any slack.

As colors says, there are a lot of connections between season 3 and Karate Kid Part II. They even used Moody Blues' 'Rock 'N' Roll Over You' during the football match.


Japan's my home away from home, so I was pleased to see Daniel return there (even though they clearly shot those scenes in the US). And it was great to see Tamlyn Tomita and Yuji Okumoto reprise their roles. It felt appropriate for Chozen to break the cycle of violence, since his own master, Sato, had previously done the same thing. While he may have once been a bully, Chozen is still ultimately a student of Miyagi-do karate and he clearly now has a deeper understanding of its defensive philosophy than he did in his youth. I'd like to see him return in a future season, perhaps travelling to America to help Daniel and Johnny battle Kreese, Silver and Barnes.

Speaking of Kreese, I enjoyed the flashbacks depicting his origin story. He's now evolved from simple bully to murdering sociopath. It can't be much longer now until Terry Silver and Mike Barnes make a return. Just as Daniel's trip to Japan revisited the origins of Miyagi-do, so the Vietnam flashbacks exposed the dark origin of Cobra Kai karate. For me, that was one of the most compelling aspects of this season.

Ali's appearance was ok, but somewhat anticlimactic after the build-up in seasons 1 and 2. Elisabeth Shue has aged well, but other than some nostalgic banter with Daniel and Johnny her return felt lightweight and didn't have any significant impact besides soothing the animosity between her two exes.

So those are my initial thoughts on the new episodes. Following the dip in quality in the second half of season 2, I viewed season 3 as a make or break moment for this series. Having now watched it, I'm happy to say that the show still has a lot of life and creativity in it. I'll definitely be back for season 4.

But who else will be back?

Will Hillary Swank put in an appearance as Miyagi's only other American student? Or will they not bother with her, since no one seems to care about that movie?

The pieces are obviously being arranged for Silver to appear next season. The show's makers have said they've a plan for six seasons altogether. Will they save Barnes for season 5 or 6?

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun,  3 Jan  2021, 00:01
Ali's appearance was ok, but somewhat anticlimactic after the build-up in seasons 1 and 2. Elisabeth Shue has aged well, but other than some nostalgic banter with Daniel and Johnny her return felt lightweight and didn't have any significant impact besides soothing the animosity between her two exes.

I interpreted her participation in season 03 as a way for Daniel to put his history with her in perspective and for Johnny to get closure before moving forward with Miguel's mom. There are other ways of achieving those ends but I rather enjoy how it was done on the show.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun,  3 Jan  2021, 00:01But who else will be back?

The list is running thin. Basically, the new characters from KK3 are all I can think of. Silver and Barnes are most obvious there.

Still, there's also Jessica Andrews. Not sure how that would work out tho since Jessica was never rly a love interest for Daniel and their assocation was strictly platonic. Still, there could be an angle there I'm overlooking.

In terms of old faces, there's not much to choose from that I can recall.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun,  3 Jan  2021, 00:01Will Hillary Swank put in an appearance as Miyagi's only other American student? Or will they not bother with her, since no one seems to care about that movie?

It is strange how that movie launched Swank's career while at the same time being so forgettable. A truly bizarre turn of events. But that's life, I guess.

After all these years, I get the idea that Swank's dignity doesn't suffer too much from that movie. And in fairness to all parties involved, I don't remember anything out and out horrible about the film. It seems the stink on the movie is it's not as good as the first KK film. Be that as it may, TNKK is aight. I am familiar with the idea of the "feel good" eighties comedy-drama that TNKK aspired to be stuck out like a sore thumb in the overall more cynical nineties. Whether or not that's a fair critique of the film, the fact remains that my memory of TNKK is that it's basically a more feminine version of the first film. I don't love it (as might be obvious from the fact that I've only seen it the once) but I don't consider it to be too much of a black mark on the franchise's history.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun,  3 Jan  2021, 00:01The pieces are obviously being arranged for Silver to appear next season. The show's makers have said they've a plan for six seasons altogether. Will they save Barnes for season 5 or 6?

My guess is season 06. Honestly, the showrunners got two seasons of material just out of the first KK movie, which I'd never thought was possible. I think it makes sense to spread Silver and Barnes out to get as much out of this thing as possible.

Silver's loyalty is obviously to Kreese. But now, he has beef of his own with Daniel. It's not an entirely altruistic thing for Silver anymore, I conjecture. And being as there's another tournament coming up, I think it makes sense that Silver has an interest in evening the score with Daniel, if he can. A vicarious victory for Cobra Kai at the tournament might be very appealing to Silver.

As far as Mike Barnes is concerned, Chozen sets (or continues) the precedent that a former baddie can turn over a new leaf. Barnes was never anything more than a hired gun in the first place so it would be easy to put the character on a different path if he's brought back. He never had a personal vendetta against Daniel; he was just in it for the money. For me, bringing Barnes back (as a villain or redeemed) is a final season type of move. But the showrunners consistently surprise me so I'm open to whatever they want.

Season 03 was so good that I figured it was about time for a rewatch. Originally, I only watched the episodes the once using newly created gmail accounts.

Rewatching season 01 was a pleasure. It rly held up the second time around.

Getting into season 02 and there's a moment I think I overlooked from Back In Black, episode 02. The bit where Daniel and Amanda team up to sell ten cars in one day after Cole poached their best salesmen. A lot of times in TV shows, marriage is boring and, in short order, imperiled. Because that creates drama. But mostly, Daniel and Amanda have a pretty smooth marriage. There's just not much there to talk about.

Back In Black shows them working effectively as a team, achieving more than either of them could individually. It goes a long way toward making you believe they could stick together all these years. Because they really are good together, both as a couple and as business partners.

You can extrapolate a lot from that. Daniel is the guy who's in it for love of the game. He loves cars and he loves sales. I've met guys who are born salesman. No matter what other job they may have, they'll always be salesmen. But while Amanda has a talent for sales, her gift is big picture thinking. It wouldn't come as a surprise if Daniel owned his own car lot, did well and it was Amanda who saw possibilities for expansion, acquiring other lots and building the company into a more refined and upscale "franchise".

Here's an interesting retrospective on the Karate Kid franchise.

;D

Man, this series is riding a gravy train with biscuit wheels. It might be that it's benefiting from comparisons to other franchises which are getting run off into a ditch. But these days, Karate Kid/Cobra Kai is the only franchise I can think of that's being handled with care and trying to give the fans what they want.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Fri, 28 May  2021, 12:20
Man, this series riding a gravy train with biscuit wheels. It might be that it's benefiting from comparisons to other franchises which are getting run off into a ditch. But these days, Karate Kid/Cobra Kai is the only franchise I can think of that's being handled with care and trying to give the fans what they want.

If you went back in time and told me that a Karate Kid sequel would've been handled with more care than a new Star Wars trilogy I wouldn't have believed you.

He's back.


Now we just need Mike Barnes and the villain roster will be complete.

Cobra Kai/Ninja Turtles crossover action figure packs are now available to buy.

I'm in. I am so in.

Quote from: thecolorsblend on Fri, 10 Dec  2021, 18:25
I'm in. I am so in.

An ironic post from me, considering I'm not super into this season so far.

I understand that in the Karate Kid franchise, nobody ever goes to the police. But this season is pushing that dramatic conceit to the breaking point.

I'm struggling to find a single member of the LaRusso family that I even like this season. So far, Amanda is the only who comes off even halfway likeable this season. Literally, the rest of the immediate family are a-holes.

I wouldn't mind that as much if the writing at least acknowledged that they're jerks. But except for Anthony bullying Kenny, that's not really happening.

I didn't rly enjoy season 04 very much. It did somewhat address my "Nobody ever calls the cops" criticism, sort of. But it's starting to feel like this show is creatively running out of steam.

Kind of wondering what Barnes's motivation will be. Before, he was just a hired gun. His business with Daniel truly was nothing personal (even tho it's clear Barnes didn't like Daniel on a personal level).

So, you have to wonder what would bring him back. Money worked last time but doing that again seems like going back to the well.

I didn't realise until yesterday that season 5 was out. Maybe it's because the last season was only released eight months ago, but it feels like this one has had less publicity. Anyhow, I watched the first four episodes last night and so far it's good. It's shaping up to be a strong season, as long as the second half is as entertaining as the first.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun, 11 Sep  2022, 15:43
I didn't realise until yesterday that season 5 was out. Maybe it's because the last season was only released eight months ago, but it feels like this one has had less publicity.

I see I wasn't the only person to notice the lack of promotion.


Oh dear. I hope we do get the final season.

I finished watching season 5 last night. I really enjoyed it. In fact it might be my favourite season so far. Earlier seasons had occasionally suffered from soap opera moments where characters would fall out over petty conflicts and misunderstandings that could easily be resolved if they just talked about it like reasonable people (some might argue that's the central premise of the entire franchise, but there's an important distinction between petty conflict and meaningful conflict). Season 5 trolls the audience on more than one occasion with similar fallings out, only to play the "just kidding" card and go in a different direction. I liked this. It allowed characters who ought to be friends by now to become friends, and for quarrels that ought to have been resolved by now to be resolved. The protagonists and their relationships are almost all progressing in a satisfying way.

Rather than retread the same formulaic scenarios, which is a trap seasons 2, 3 and 4 sometimes fell into, we get some interesting fresh storylines in season 5, such as Miguel's trip to Mexico and Chozen's infiltration of Cobra Kai. None of these subplots drags on for too long, which keeps the season as a whole pacy. I never got a sense of one particular storyline or idea being protracted longer than was necessary. There's also some effective use of foreshadowing and pay-off, such as the call back to the 'protect the egg' training exercise when the kids are shielding the computer in the final episode. All in all, the writing this season was good.

The tradition of bringing back characters from the original movies continues, and this time we get SPOILERS Sean Kanan as Mike Barnes and Robin Lively as Jessica Andrews, who we now learn is the cousin of Daniel's wife Amanda!  Ralph Macchio and William Zabka are as strong as ever, but I felt Chozen was the MVP among the older legacy characters this season. It was great to see Yuji Okumoto get so much screen time and the chance to show different sides to his character. Thomas Ian Griffith also deserves praise for his captivatingly sly portrayal of Silver. I hope he'll be back in season 6.

Among the younger stars, Miguel is still my favourite character, though Tanner Buchanan and Jacob Bertrand continue to be the best screen fighters. If they ever make a Batman: Year One movie set in the Schumacherverse, Buchanan would be my top pick for Bruce Wayne. He looks a bit like a young Val Kilmer...


...and he's got the martial arts skills to convincingly pull off the fight scenes.


But who could play the younger version of Tommy Lee Jones's Harvey Dent?

Anyway, I shall be sad when Cobra Kai ends, since it's the only scripted TV show I'm enjoying right now. But the story is clearly nearing the point where a conclusion is warranted. I'd like to see one more season, perhaps bringing back Hilary Swank as Julie Pierce and maybe even Michael Ironside as Colonel Dugan (did he serve in Vietnam with Kreese and Silver?), and then lay the Karate Kid franchise to rest. End it on a high note and seal it off against further continuation. The only spinoff I'd be interested in after that would be a Miyagi prequel.

On a related note, I finally watched The Next Karate Kid (1994) recently. Even viewing it with low expectations, it's bad. The villains are motiveless, there's no storyline and the fight scenes are rubbish. They had an idea for a new character, and Swank was well cast in the role, but they didn't have a good dramatic conflict to frame her in. In that sense it reminds me of the 1984 Supergirl movie, which also had a good lead character let down by a weak storyline. It feels totally vapid, with none of the intensity, drama or heart that define the LaRusso films. Still, the makers of Cobra Kai might redeem it somewhat if they bring back certain characters in season 6.

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun, 18 Sep  2022, 18:44

Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sun, 11 Sep  2022, 15:43
I didn't realise until yesterday that season 5 was out. Maybe it's because the last season was only released eight months ago, but it feels like this one has had less publicity.

I see I wasn't the only person to notice the lack of promotion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NV5ddzM-ZSY

Oh dear. I hope we do get the final season.

I finished watching season 5 last night. I really enjoyed it. In fact it might be my favourite season so far. Earlier seasons had occasionally suffered from soap opera moments where characters would fall out over petty conflicts and misunderstandings that could easily be resolved if they just talked about it like reasonable people (some might argue that's the central premise of the entire franchise, but there's an important distinction between petty conflict and meaningful conflict). Season 5 trolls the audience on more than one occasion with similar fallings out, only to play the "just kidding" card and go in a different direction. I liked this. It allowed characters who ought to be friends by now to become friends, and for quarrels that ought to have been resolved by now to be resolved. The protagonists and their relationships are almost all progressing in a satisfying way.

It's difficult to get a consensus on this season. It seems to be mixed, although I have seen a lot of people with your reaction about it being their favorite thus far. For me it's one of the weaker seasons. The only one I'd put below it is season 2.

I was surprised at how truncated the Mexico storyline was. By the time it ended in the second episode I was asking myself "What was the point of that?" Also, this season really hammered home that this show does not take place in the real world. It's very much a heightened reality. For example how Miguel's Dad treats him felt odd. This stranger did one good deed and after that the father basically treats him like a member of the family to the point that he lets him stay in his home.

Also, the Sam/Miguel storyline was a little cringe this time around.

So overall it was a mixed season but, like every season of this show, I did think there were a lot of great moments. I liked the storyline of Silver vs Daniel which was very Rocky 3. I liked that Johnny is finally putting his life together. I also thought this wrapped up a lot of arcs that have been around since the beginning of the show. It almost felt like a series finale in a lot of ways.


The mvp for me was definitely Thomas Ian Griffith. He was great from beginning to end. It actually made me want to see him in more roles.

This show is definitely a soap opera. The creators have been pretty open about that. When they pitcher the show to Ralph Macchio they called it a Karate soap opera.

My main question is will this tie in to
Cobra Kai. Weird how they have yet to fully address that.

I've never bothered with the 2010 version, and don't see a whole hell of a lot of upside in fitting that movie into the Karate Kid/Cobra Kai continuity, but it's a very much wait-and-see on this.

Quote from: BatmanFurst on Wed, 22 Nov  2023, 13:15My main question is will this tie in to
Cobra Kai. Weird how they have yet to fully address that.

I think we're all just waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Shared.

Cinematic.

Universe.

 ::)

It looks like season 6 is basically three mini-seasons. I've enjoyed this show a lot, but it's time to wrap it up before it overstays its welcome. Hopefully they'll end it on a high note.