Looks like Bruce Timm, Matt Reeves and JJ Abrams are coming out with a new animated show on HBO Max. Sounds good except for the JJ part, but oh well. lol
He's got the longer ears here. Looks like Bob Kane's oldschool Batman design.
https://twitter.com/THR/status/1395012888235061256?s=20
(https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/batman.jpg)
Here's the description:
"The series will be thrilling, cinematic and evocative of Batman's noir roots, while diving deeper into the psychology of these iconic characters. We cannot wait to share this new world."
"Utilizing state-of-the-art animation techniques and technologies available, this powerful creative partnership will once again reinvent Batman and his iconic rogue's gallery with sophisticated storytelling, nuanced characters and intense action sequences all set in a visually striking world."
This sounds amazing! 8)
The concept is great - taking the spirit of BTAS and merging it with the early comics, creating something new rather than a direct continuation. I'm happy about that. The JJ influence gives me pause, but the addition of Timm and Reeves has to mean something. Anything noir or psychology based is going to raise my interest.
The avalanche keeps getting bigger:
The Batman
GCPD
Batman: Caped Crusader
The Flash
Batman '89
Batman: Earth One Volume 3
The Long Halloween Parts 1 and 2
Gotham Knights
WB have gone all in with Reeves. His influence is shaping up to be larger than that of Nolan.
Yeah, Reeves' influence is going to be huge/
Oooo
Quote from: Travesty on Wed, 19 May 2021, 15:04
Yeah, Reeves' influence is going to be huge/
We have a ton of Batman projects coming up, but long term, the Reeves movies and the cartoon will be what define the character into the future. It feels like a rebirth similar to the 1990s, with the brand uniting behind a specific tone. We had Burton doing his thing, with an extended animated series taking that atmosphere and fleshing it out further.
Does Giacchino provide the theme?
Do they bring back BTAS voice cast members, or start fresh?
Even if previous voice talent returns, leaving BTAS continuity behind was the right choice.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Thu, 21 Jan 2021, 05:15
They've been doing the Adventures Continue comic line recently which gives me reason to suspect this could happen. Part of me would prefer them to create something new, as was the case with The Brave and the Bold or even Beware The Batman. But from a business point of view, a BTAS revival would generate interest in HBO Max.
I'm unsure if the heights of the 90s could be reached, especially when we consider the likes of Batman and Harley Quinn. But if it happens, it happens. We can only sit back and assess the product. We're going to be well fed with Batman content in the near future, and this would be another bowl of dessert.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Thu, 21 Jan 2021, 05:37
It's like how they did the two B66 animated movies. You're looking back and trying to imitate something, but you're approaching things from a modern perspective. I don't think that can be helped. You're not in the flow of the original era, which once was the modern day.
So what ends up happening? Things that wouldn't have appeared on the show start appearing, and it may not feel organic. If things happened back in the day, we'd accept it unquestioningly. We would've grown up with it, and have had years of familiarity. Doing something new years after the fact feels different. A sense of consistency is vital.
I'd give a revival a chance, though. I'd like to see the transition from Robin to Nightwing play out on screen.
I actually came to like Beware The Batman. But did it compare to the likes of BTAS, Beyond or The Brave and the Bold? No. After pulling the plug early on Beware, they need to make this one last. Expecting a replication of BTAS's lightning in a bottle is unrealistic, but based on concept and art style alone there's potential for this to be great.
Quote from: Travesty on Wed, 19 May 2021, 14:19
Here's the description:
"The series will be thrilling, cinematic and evocative of Batman's noir roots, while diving deeper into the psychology of these iconic characters. We cannot wait to share this new world."
"Utilizing state-of-the-art animation techniques and technologies available, this powerful creative partnership will once again reinvent Batman and his iconic rogue's gallery with sophisticated storytelling, nuanced characters and intense action sequences all set in a visually striking world."
This sounds amazing! 8)
I'm not very keen, to be honest. Strong possibility it could retread old ground with BTAS. Aside from Timm, I'm not a huge fan of Abrams or Reeves.
Plus, I'm rather bored with Batman animations at the moment. I much prefer something new with other DC characters. How about a new Superman cartoon interpretation that's not handcuffed by nostalgia? One that's daring and not pandering to fools who freak out if he doesn't smile every second.
(https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/batman.jpg)
This artwork gives me high anticipation of what's to come, since this appears to be very evocative of the early Bob Kane and Bill Finger comics that I have wished to see ever since I first read Batman From the 30's to the 70's. At the same time, I'm very wary with the involvement of J.J. Abrams. You would figure Bruce Tim's name attached to this would be enough. Abrams involvement with rebooted material has been very controversial over the years and he'll get the finger pointed at him if there's anything controversial about this. I'm hoping this will be the opportunity to make a Batman animated series that has no standards and practices looking over them. If they needed Abrams and Matt Reeves' name attached to this to sell it, then I'm grateful for their services. Just don't make them think they're more qualified of handling this material.
Quote from: Travesty on Wed, 19 May 2021, 14:10
Looks like Bruce Timm, Matt Reeves and JJ Abrams are coming out with a new animated show on HBO Max. Sounds good except for the JJ part, but oh well. lol
He's got the longer ears here. Looks like Bob Kane's oldschool Batman design.
https://twitter.com/THR/status/1395012888235061256?s=20
(https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/batman.jpg)
Quote from: Travesty on Wed, 19 May 2021, 14:19
Here's the description:
"The series will be thrilling, cinematic and evocative of Batman's noir roots, while diving deeper into the psychology of these iconic characters. We cannot wait to share this new world."
"Utilizing state-of-the-art animation techniques and technologies available, this powerful creative partnership will once again reinvent Batman and his iconic rogue's gallery with sophisticated storytelling, nuanced characters and intense action sequences all set in a visually striking world."
This sounds amazing! 8)
As far as I'm concerned, Matt Reeves hasn't set a foot wrong so far. I like everything I've seen and heard about his new movie and I'm happy to see him collaborating with Timm. This November will mark the tenth anniversary of the final episode of Batman: The Brave & the Bold, and I don't think there's been a great Batman TV show since then. A decade is too long to go without another classic Batman show. We're ready for this.
I also share the appreciation others have expressed for that poster. It's classic Timm artwork that evokes the pre-Robin Golden Age Batman era. It reminds me of these.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/13/ee/72/13ee726f251c75ab29f6eba51c897dc2.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/tgjVfRdt/mad-monk.webp)
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Wed, 19 May 2021, 14:36The avalanche keeps getting bigger:
The Batman
GCPD
Batman: Caped Crusader
The Flash
Batman '89
Batman: Earth One Volume 3
The Long Halloween Parts 1 and 2
Gotham Knights
I've said this before, but it bears repeating – Batman fans have a lot to look forward to right now. :)
Quote from: Kamdan on Thu, 20 May 2021, 02:24This artwork gives me high anticipation of what's to come, since this appears to be very evocative of the early Bob Kane and Bill Finger comics that I have wished to see ever since I first read Batman From the 30's to the 70's. At the same time, I'm very wary with the involvement of J.J. Abrams. You would figure Bruce Tim's name attached to this would be enough. Abrams involvement with rebooted material has been very controversial over the years and he'll get the finger pointed at him if there's anything controversial about this. I'm hoping this will be the opportunity to make a Batman animated series that has no standards and practices looking over them. If they needed Abrams and Matt Reeves' name attached to this to sell it, then I'm grateful for their services. Just don't make them think they're more qualified of handling this material.
My thoughts exactly. I'm concerned about JJ Abrams' name being attached to so many upcoming DC films and TV shows. I understand that his production company is in charge of the whole Justice League Woke enterprise that begins with the new Superman movie, but I don't see why he has to be involved with this too. Hopefully his producer credit is as perfunctory as Burton's was on Batman Forever and he'll have no real creative input.
(https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-dc8f73b9c4b79f16950c6c49c78b09e8)
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56
As far as I'm concerned, Matt Reeves hasn't set a foot wrong so far. I like everything I've seen and heard about his new movie and I'm happy to see him collaborating with Timm. This November will mark the tenth anniversary of the final episode of Batman: The Brave & the Bold, and I don't think there's been a great Batman TV show since then. A decade is too long to go without another classic Batman show. We're ready for this.
We're on the same page here. Going back to the very beginning is stripping things back as far as they can go, which can be liberating. He's truly a creature of the night with that depiction. Supernatural themes, castles, moonlight and all those things would be my preference. The purple gloves would be a bonus.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56
I also share the appreciation others have expressed for that poster. It's classic Timm artwork that evokes the pre-Robin Golden Age Batman era. It reminds me of these.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/13/ee/72/13ee726f251c75ab29f6eba51c897dc2.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/tgjVfRdt/mad-monk.webp)
Something similar to this would be welcome:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFwOS2R9o_8&feature=emb_title
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56
My thoughts exactly. I'm concerned about JJ Abrams' name being attached to so many upcoming DC films and TV shows. I understand that his production company is in charge of the whole Justice League Woke enterprise that begins with the new Superman movie, but I don't see why he has to be involved with this too. Hopefully his producer credit is as perfunctory as Burton's was on Batman Forever and he'll have no real creative input.
Judging by the poster Batman hasn't been race or gendered bended, so that component is safe. Reeves has me on board with his vision, and it's showing he's attached to the character for the long haul. This isn't the conduct of a man who is looking to cut and run anytime soon.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/13/ee/72/13ee726f251c75ab29f6eba51c897dc2.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/tgjVfRdt/mad-monk.webp)
The evoking of those images is my primary fuel of anticipation of how potentially great this series could be. I have for years wanted to commission someone to draw Batman in a similar fashion looming over Gotham Cathedral. What they came up with is very much in line of what I'd like to see it look like.
I'm hoping the style of the show will be mostly 2D with 3D used to add depth to the environments, like what was done for Mask of the Phantasm. Warner Animation has done a great job making new Looney Tunes and Tom & Jerry features that invokes their predecessors. I hope the final result will be like the initial episodes of Batman: The Animated Series before the budget cuts made for the subsequent New Adventures episodes. I trust they learned their lesson with Beware the Batman not to go fully CG.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56
My thoughts exactly. I'm concerned about JJ Abrams' name being attached to so many upcoming DC films and TV shows. I understand that his production company is in charge of the whole Justice League Woke enterprise that begins with the new Superman movie, but I don't see why he has to be involved with this too. Hopefully his producer credit is as perfunctory as Burton's was on Batman Forever and he'll have no real creative input.
(https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-dc8f73b9c4b79f16950c6c49c78b09e8)
It's painful to me thinking that Abrams' name is as good as when Steven Spielberg used his name for animated productions like Tiny Toons and Animaniacs in the wake of the success of Roger Rabbit. The extend of Spielberg's involvement was just an idea and to lend credibility. I don't find Abrams to be very credible but I guess he is to a certain crowd. hopefully, that is the extent of his involvement and to be a "cheerleader" when it's time to promote it.
Burton's name on Forever had some initial clout when Keaton was still attached to star in it. Once he finally decided to step out, that's when it became more of Schumacher's show with Goldsman rewriting the script to make it more of its own thing than being the third that followed Burton's first two.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56As far as I'm concerned, Matt Reeves hasn't set a foot wrong so far. I like everything I've seen and heard about his new movie and I'm happy to see him collaborating with Timm. This November will mark the tenth anniversary of the final episode of Batman: The Brave & the Bold, and I don't think there's been a great Batman TV show since then. A decade is too long to go without another classic Batman show. We're ready for this.
I also share the appreciation others have expressed for that poster. It's classic Timm artwork that evokes the pre-Robin Golden Age Batman era. It reminds me of these.
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/13/ee/72/13ee726f251c75ab29f6eba51c897dc2.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/tgjVfRdt/mad-monk.webp)
Not sure if I've ever said so before. But I almost see The Bat-Man from 'Tec #27-#37 to be different from Batman as we see him from 'Tec #38 and going forward. And if the art is anything to go by, it seems like this series will take more inspiration from The Bat-Man stuff than anything else.
And just so we can be clear with each other, for me that's an absolute joy and triumph. I adore The Bat-Man and hope there's more of that influence in Batman media in the future. Definitely welcome. And not just because the Bronze Age, the Miller Stuff, The Long Halloween and so forth have all been mined very well by this point either.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56My thoughts exactly. I'm concerned about JJ Abrams' name being attached to so many upcoming DC films and TV shows. I understand that his production company is in charge of the whole Justice League Woke enterprise that begins with the new Superman movie, but I don't see why he has to be involved with this too. Hopefully his producer credit is as perfunctory as Burton's was on Batman Forever and he'll have no real creative input.
(https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-dc8f73b9c4b79f16950c6c49c78b09e8)
I've wondered the same thing. And I'm toying with a theory that in today's world, every jerk in Hollywood wants to be "The Kevin Feige of [insert franchise]". I wouldn't be shocked if there was some sort of contractual demand on JJ's part that he get producer credit on every DC whatever from now on. Because he's trying to be position himself as "The Kevin Feige of DC's New Movies".
I think my theory holds water since this animated Batman series would've probably gone into preproduction just about the time that TROS started preproduction or even principal photography. At that time, Abrams had no ties whatsoever with WB or Batman or anything else as far as the public record is concerned. For those reasons, it's safe to say that Abrams probably will have no real creative impact on the first season.
The second season, however, is a different argument.
Frankly, I believe there's every reason to be concerned about the control Abrams will probably be able to exert. In spite of the fact that he's a demonstrable franchise-wrecker, he pulls a lot of water in Hollyweird. I worry that Matt Reeves will make an awesome Batman film and then Abrams, who wants all the credit and glory for himself, will chase Reeves away and then wreck everything with DC just like he did with Star Trek and just like he did with Star Wars.
Whatever, there's nothing we can do about it. And AT&T doesn't seem interested in doing anything themselves. So, enjoy what you can while you can, guys. Because it may not last very long, I'm sad to say.
SoooOoOoo, this is the project Timm was working on that was being reported on, rather than a B:TAS continuation?
Actually, I'm kinda relieved about that.
At this stage in the game, I'm more intrigued by Reeves' association with this project than I am Timm and Jar Jar.
Teaser poster looks interesting.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Thu, 20 May 2021, 11:56
(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/13/ee/72/13ee726f251c75ab29f6eba51c897dc2.jpg)
This is exactly what I thought of when I first saw it, too.
More excited for this than I have been for anything in a long time.
Quote from: Catwoman on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 05:01
More excited for this than I have been for anything in a long time.
Long time no see, wow.
Quote from: thecolorsblend on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 11:28
Quote from: Catwoman on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 05:01
More excited for this than I have been for anything in a long time.
Long time no see, wow.
Yup. Surprise.
Quote from: Catwoman on Sun, 12 Sep 2021, 03:50
Quote from: thecolorsblend on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 11:28
Quote from: Catwoman on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 05:01
More excited for this than I have been for anything in a long time.
Long time no see, wow.
Yup. Surprise.
(https://c.tenor.com/FNiGWKR_R14AAAAC/gordon-ramsay-get-out.gif)
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Sun, 12 Sep 2021, 04:57
Quote from: Catwoman on Sun, 12 Sep 2021, 03:50
Quote from: thecolorsblend on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 11:28
Quote from: Catwoman on Wed, 8 Sep 2021, 05:01
More excited for this than I have been for anything in a long time.
Long time no see, wow.
Yup. Surprise.
(https://c.tenor.com/FNiGWKR_R14AAAAC/gordon-ramsay-get-out.gif)
(https://c.tenor.com/NwlDcg_ZjBIAAAAC/i-missed-you-too-how-are-you.gif)
(https://c.tenor.com/ZqlZsXdpZeQAAAAC/miss-you-so-much-hugs.gif)
Don't know how I missed this. But, welcome back, Catwoman!
Your presence always brightens this place up. :)
Quote from: GBglide on Mon, 13 Sep 2021, 04:24
Don't know how I missed this. But, welcome back, Catwoman!
Your presence always brightens this place up. :)
Hiya. Are you still doing your Lego Gotham?
I really hope there's some news about this series this week, I kind of hijacked this thread. Whoops.
Quote from: Catwoman on Mon, 13 Sep 2021, 05:04
Quote from: GBglide on Mon, 13 Sep 2021, 04:24
Don't know how I missed this. But, welcome back, Catwoman!
Your presence always brightens this place up. :)
Hiya. Are you still doing your Lego Gotham?
I really hope there's some news about this series this week, I kind of hijacked this thread. Whoops.
I haven't worked much on Lego lately, I've been busy customizing a room for my Batman '89 collection.
https://www.batman-online.com/forum/index.php?topic=4079
If they're going down the grounded, dark road once more like Nolan, I think the aim of the new film and animated series should be introducing more atmosphere. There's no reason why Gotham can't be covered in shadow, drenched in rain and have an aesthetic that is an elevated version of reality. The very early comics did it, and that's what I'm hoping for.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Tue, 14 Sep 2021, 01:20
If they're going down the grounded, dark road once more like Nolan, I think the aim of the new film and animated series should be introducing more atmosphere. There's no reason why Gotham can't be covered in shadow, drenched in rain and have an aesthetic that is an elevated version of reality. The very early comics did it, and that's what I'm hoping for.
I agree totally. To me a rainy late autumn evening feels like the definitive setting for Batman. My fanfics that I never finished always were full of rain or at least a cloud filled sky that blocked out the moon most nights. And the days were always overcast.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Thu, 20 May 2021, 13:58
Something similar to this would be welcome:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFwOS2R9o_8&feature=emb_title
They just said this was the pitch for Caped Crusader. They also said this is basically a re-imagining of BTAS, and that it'll be a little bit more adult, and do things they couldn't, because of the limitations they had on it.
No new artwork or clips, but they said they're working on it.
Some of their comments have me a little worried. B:TAS already had a mature and sophisticated tone, and it didn't need strong violence or sexual content to appear grownup. Timm also said it's going to be more 'modern' in terms of representation and inclusivity, which suggests the same underlying political ideology that's driving most of DC's other projects right now. Jar Jar Abrams' involvement also does little to inspire confidence.
I'm trying to remain optimistic, but there were a few red flags flown in that panel.
Diversity just means "No white people".
This detail was the only real lowlight from a good selection of Batman media.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sat, 16 Oct 2021, 20:26
Some of their comments have me a little worried. B:TAS already had a mature and sophisticated tone, and it didn't need strong violence or sexual content to appear grownup. Timm also said it's going to be more 'modern' in terms of representation and inclusivity, which suggests the same underlying political ideology that's driving most of DC's other projects right now. Jar Jar Abrams' involvement also does little to inspire confidence.
I'm trying to remain optimistic, but there were a few red flags flown in that panel.
The Animated Series had to go through standards and practices for Saturday morning television despite being initially convinced for prime time television. I trust that they don't want to do something as drastic as the infamous sex scene between Batman and Batgirl in The Killing Joke, but I believe Timm wants to feel free to depict the actions displayed in this piece he did that were forbidden to do on the show.
(https://i.redd.it/hcc5th2ayah41.jpg)
Abrams and Reeves' job is to provide support for Timm to do what he wants. There wasn't a "name" like that attached to the Animated Series. I don't understand why "representation and inclusivity" are considered to be "red flags" for this series.
Quote from: Kamdan on Mon, 18 Oct 2021, 03:12
Abrams and Reeves' job is to provide support for Timm to do what he wants. There wasn't a "name" like that attached to the Animated Series. I don't understand why "representation and inclusivity" are considered to be "red flags" for this series.
Some things that would otherwise be commendable often (not always) turn out ham-fisted, distracting, and sanctimonious when they're imposed on material like this to ride a cultural current.
I'm more worried about what Timm and co. might cook up without content restrictions myself; sometimes, ratings standards can improve these stories by forcing text into subtext and making writers get clever to work or dodge the censors. And too many people working in comics and their adaptations seem to think that being as violent or sexual as possible automatically equates to "serious, mature fiction."
Quote from: zDBZ on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 12:32
I'm more worried about what Timm and co. might cook up without content restrictions myself; sometimes, ratings standards can improve these stories by forcing text into subtext and making writers get clever to work or dodge the censors. And too many people working in comics and their adaptations seem to think that being as violent or sexual as possible automatically equates to "serious, mature fiction."
Agree. Holding back can sometimes equal being more true to the characters. Certain things can feel out of character if the guardrails are taken away. The Killing Joke adaption being a key example of that, with it also being so unnecessary.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 13:20
Quote from: zDBZ on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 12:32
I'm more worried about what Timm and co. might cook up without content restrictions myself; sometimes, ratings standards can improve these stories by forcing text into subtext and making writers get clever to work or dodge the censors. And too many people working in comics and their adaptations seem to think that being as violent or sexual as possible automatically equates to "serious, mature fiction."
Agree. Holding back can sometimes equal being more true to the characters. Certain things can feel out of character if the guardrails are taken away. The Killing Joke adaption being a key example of that, with it also being so unnecessary.
That was unnecessary for different reasons, though. TKJ was supposed to follow the comic as closely as possible, and they decided to do a 15min prologue that had nothing to do with the story. It just didn't make any sense to the comic.
I feel like that's totally different from not wanting to be censored for certain ideas. If they want to show The Joker killing someone, they can.
It is quite true that dodging the censors can result in better focus on character department, but it can equally squander something just as easily. It's going to be great to see guns used in a more violent manner like they did in the movies instead of just being used to smash things up a bit.
The Killing Joke situation was brought up due to the low runtime the film would have had if they just stuck with the comic. It did make sense from their perspective to establish more of a backstory between Batman and Batgirl to make the impact of her crippling stick more than it did in the original story. Adding that material was a clear example of why Alan Moore doesn't want his name on any adaptation of his works.
The whole Batman/Batgirl relationship was something from the initial conception of the show and it was definitely a plus that wasn't followed though that way in the series, aside from hints of it in Batman Beyond. They are quite aware of the backlash this gained and I am sure they are going to not repeat the same mistake.
I've been made aware that the show will be part of Cartoon Network's ACME Night programming. This apparently is designed for "family viewing" which I hope means that they'll air a more censored version of what's to be on HBO Max. If this is just going to be a remake of the Animated Series in the mature content department, there's nothing to gain out of this endeavor.
Quote from: Travesty on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 15:00
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 13:20
Quote from: zDBZ on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 12:32
I'm more worried about what Timm and co. might cook up without content restrictions myself; sometimes, ratings standards can improve these stories by forcing text into subtext and making writers get clever to work or dodge the censors. And too many people working in comics and their adaptations seem to think that being as violent or sexual as possible automatically equates to "serious, mature fiction."
Agree. Holding back can sometimes equal being more true to the characters. Certain things can feel out of character if the guardrails are taken away. The Killing Joke adaption being a key example of that, with it also being so unnecessary.
That was unnecessary for different reasons, though. TKJ was supposed to follow the comic as closely as possible, and they decided to do a 15min prologue that had nothing to do with the story. It just didn't make any sense to the comic.
I feel like that's totally different from not wanting to be censored for certain ideas. If they want to show The Joker killing someone, they can.
The statement about TKJ animated adaption is true, but I feel that it may not just simply be about taking one more step in depicting something, such as showing a gruesome death instead of someone laughing from gas. If the producers know all guardrails are off from the start, concept creation thinking has to change somehow. Batman having sex with Batgirl is where things can lead. Harley emitting gas in the Batmobile, no matter how minor, also feels so out of place. It really depends what level of escalation we are talking about here.
Quote from: Travesty on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 15:00
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 13:20
Quote from: zDBZ on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 12:32
I'm more worried about what Timm and co. might cook up without content restrictions myself; sometimes, ratings standards can improve these stories by forcing text into subtext and making writers get clever to work or dodge the censors. And too many people working in comics and their adaptations seem to think that being as violent or sexual as possible automatically equates to "serious, mature fiction."
Agree. Holding back can sometimes equal being more true to the characters. Certain things can feel out of character if the guardrails are taken away. The Killing Joke adaption being a key example of that, with it also being so unnecessary.
That was unnecessary for different reasons, though. TKJ was supposed to follow the comic as closely as possible, and they decided to do a 15min prologue that had nothing to do with the story. It just didn't make any sense to the comic.
I feel like that's totally different from not wanting to be censored for certain ideas. If they want to show The Joker killing someone, they can.
The Joker can kill as often as he wants, but I don't want to see him pushing the carcass of a man he skinned alive onto a stage, or chaining Harley up in a room full of skeletons he tells her are ex-Harleys, or stapling his face back on.
Not that I think Timm would do these things specifically; he's got his own odd tics. But this is the kind of stuff in comics that puts me off. It's not "mature," it's gratuitous, and it turns characters meant to be larger-than-life into cheap knockoffs of low-grade crime fiction.
Looks like this got canceled at HBO. They are going to try and shop it around at other places, but it looks like it's probably dead.
Quote from: Travesty on Tue, 23 Aug 2022, 02:40
Looks like this got canceled at HBO. They are going to try and shop it around at other places, but it looks like it's probably dead.
I'm starting to wonder if the operating philosophy is to protect the Batman brand.
There were more Batman-related productions in the pipeline than anything else. So, logically, if a bunch of stuff gets cancelled, it stands to reason that Batman would be hit hardest by that.
And yet, this doesn't come off like random chance. It LOOKS like anything related to Ben Affleck is safe. But everything else Batman-related seems to be facing a dicey future. Pattinson's second time at bat hasn't been greenlit yet and it's looking like Keaton is probably one and done.
Assuming I'm right (and I may not be), this could work to Batman's ultimate benefit (in the long run) in that it will prevent overexposure and burn out with the character.
Batman is the obvious frontman of DC, but I concur about the risk of fatigue as has most definitely been the case with Star Wars. They're saying the show is still going ahead but is looking for a new home. It could go either way at this stage. I don't think HBO Max has been a good platform so the move away from that is a positive as far as I am concerned. Especially if it's meaning a bigger focus on big budget cinema releases involving the Justice League. Keaton's return would have always been that of a returning guest if Batfleck was the assumed incumbent all along. The Batgirl film wouldn't have even happened. Keaton's era was 1989-1992, and Affleck still has more to give. That's how I'm choosing to view things. Even with some project cancellations Batman's future is hardly bare.
Quote from: zDBZ on Wed, 20 Oct 2021, 12:32
Some things that would otherwise be commendable often (not always) turn out ham-fisted, distracting, and sanctimonious when they're imposed on material like this to ride a cultural current.
I'm more worried about what Timm and co. might cook up without content restrictions myself; sometimes, ratings standards can improve these stories by forcing text into subtext and making writers get clever to work or dodge the censors. And too many people working in comics and their adaptations seem to think that being as violent or sexual as possible automatically equates to "serious, mature fiction."
Exactly. It could be coincidence, but it seemed like Timm started to lose his touch when he no longer had censors reeling him in.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Sat, 16 Oct 2021, 20:26
Some of their comments have me a little worried. B:TAS already had a mature and sophisticated tone, and it didn't need strong violence or sexual content to appear grownup. Timm also said it's going to be more 'modern' in terms of representation and inclusivity, which suggests the same underlying political ideology that's driving most of DC's other projects right now. Jar Jar Abrams' involvement also does little to inspire confidence.
I'm trying to remain optimistic, but there were a few red flags flown in that panel.
"Modern"
or "Golden Age". You can't have both. Unfortunately the project opens itself up to more critical evaluation because it's marketing itself as an adaptation of the Golden Age Batman and not an all new reboot.
The comics may have had moments of extreme violence, but they were still fun wish fulfillment of the early superhero era. It's easy to get lost in the grittiness and turn Batman into an insane caricature of himself that isn't even capable of normal human interactions. G.A. Bruce Wayne was suave and dashing, and the Batman was human and vulnerable. Furthermore, Robin was a huge part of the Golden Age, so it'd be pure revisionism to either not include him or wait until much later. In terms of publication history, Batman didn't exist an entire year without Robin, and only had ten appearances under his belt. Why so many writers are fixated on this period is beyond me.
Now was the cancellation related to the content of the show, or just an arbitrary cost-cutting measure?
Quote from: Slash Man on Thu, 25 Aug 2022, 03:22In terms of publication history, Batman didn't exist an entire year without Robin, and only had ten appearances under his belt. Why so many writers are fixated on this period is beyond me.
I've wondered the same thing.
And what I've come to realize is that early Golden Age era is amazingly vivid among hardcore Batman fans. Bill Finger and Gardner Fox were cranking out (or in some cases plagiarizing) some pretty good stories. Kane was... well, I can say that is attributed to him was improving from one issue to the next. Plus, The Case Of The Chemical Syndicate, those two Doctor Death stories and Batman Vs. The Vampire are all pretty solid stories which are riffed upon (or outright retold) to this very day.
As you say, it was a brief era. But it punches above its weight in terms of memorability.
Aside from that, writers (and fans) have had a fascination with first year Batman for quite a few decades now. It's good counterprogramming to the Always Prepared/Grant Morrison Batman. First year Batman can fail, make mistakes, not necessarily always pull out a 100% win, etc.
Plus, I think a lot fans and even a lot of writers can't shake the suspicion that the introduction of Robin was meant to give Batman another character to exposit plot info as well as provide an entry point or maybe a surrogate for the kids who were reading those stories. I think Robin's existence has been justified in other ways a million times over. But the possibility remains that the character was only ever created for writing convenience and marketing.
That's not a problem in those early stories.
Quote from: Slash Man on Thu, 25 Aug 2022, 03:22Now was the cancellation related to the content of the show, or just an arbitrary cost-cutting measure?
I think sooner or later, someone will get Bruce Timm drunk enough to tell us the true BTS stuff that went on. He's not getting any younger, he's shown a proclivity toward saying the quiet part out loud and the right amount of alcohol might loosen his lips.
Quote from: Slash Man on Thu, 25 Aug 2022, 03:22
The comics may have had moments of extreme violence, but they were still fun wish fulfillment of the early superhero era. It's easy to get lost in the grittiness and turn Batman into an insane caricature of himself that isn't even capable of normal human interactions.
This is true. Pattinson is the extreme version of the socially isolated loner, and I really like that for what it is. But it isn't the final form of Bruce or even Batman. I think that's why the early years are so great to explore. They allow that type of gradual character growth. To build a world from the ground up and take your sweet time in doing so. It's my opinion that Adam West's Batman/Bruce is the ultimate end point in that journey of evolution. Someone who experienced trauma to suit up in the first place, but is generally at peace with his past. Which is also very much the case with Kilmer.
Apparently, this has now been picked up by Amazon.
https://variety.com/2023/tv/news/batman-caped-crusader-tv-series-amazon-1235548504/#article-comments (https://variety.com/2023/tv/news/batman-caped-crusader-tv-series-amazon-1235548504/#article-comments)
I don't know if these are real or not, but they're floating around twitter right now. If real, I'm a bit mixed, but I don't flat out hate it either. What do you guys think?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GH1e9etWIAAKMuO?format=jpg&name=large)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GH1e9ipWQAAFhKK?format=jpg&name=large)
An obese Alfred isn't unheard of. I am surprised that it has more of a 30's aesthetic to it than the animated series did.
Batman looks good. Same with Catwoman and Clayface. But what's going on with Two-Face? It's like their prompt was "what would Two-Face look like in the 40s", but they forgot Two-Face was really from the early 40s.
From what I saw, they seemed to have taken a lot of cues from the coffee table book called Gotham 1919-1939.
After giving these designs another look I like the retro approach they are taking. Going for something near identical to BTAS would've been a mistake. From what I saw Clayface and Harley were my favorites. A show that digs deep into the original comics would be very interesting to see now I give this more thought, and could actually help make the case for Burton given the references his two Batman films have.
Looks like those pics that I posted a few months back were real. It's announced that it'll release on Amazon Prime on Aug 1st. Here's some official pics that they released with the announcement. I love the classic Bob Kane-ish style Batman. But we have Batman, Gordon, Harley Quinn(and Harley Quinnzelle), Catwoman, Clayface, and a shot of Bruce and Selina.
What do you guys think?
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6Y2J.img?w=768&h=433&m=6)
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6OP0.img?w=768&h=432&m=6)
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m72Ga.img?w=768&h=432&m=6)
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6STa.img?w=768&h=432&m=6&x=386&y=108&s=78&d=78)
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6Qtt.img?w=768&h=432&m=6)
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m70cv.img?w=768&h=432&m=6)
(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6Y2M.img?w=768&h=432&m=6&x=1554&y=250&s=891&d=489)
The first African American police commissioner was appointed in 1984, and this show is supposed to be early 40s?
Not digging that Harley outfit. Is there something wrong with sticking to her original red/black outfit?
AM digging that Catwoman outfit tho. Fifties chic, I like it!
All in all, this isn't shaping up too badly at all. I regret Jar Jar Abrams's involvement. But aside from him (and that wonky Harley outfit), this series looks pretty good.
Quote from: Slash Man on Thu, 9 May 2024, 23:49The first African American police commissioner was appointed in 1984, and this show is supposed to be early 40s?
We're not allowed to see the past as it actually was, didn't you know?
I dig how this looks overall. It has a specific theme and edge differentiating itself from the usual, going through the motions fare. I'll be watching.
Quote from: Slash Man on Thu, 9 May 2024, 23:49The first African American police commissioner was appointed in 1984, and this show is supposed to be early 40s?
Indeed. They're going hard on black American Gordon. The Lego movie, The Batman and now this.
Quote from: Travesty on Thu, 9 May 2024, 23:02(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6Qtt.img?w=768&h=432&m=6)
The purple cowl, dress and cape ensemble has always been my favourite Catwoman costume. I don't know if it'd work in live action, but it looks good here.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Fri, 10 May 2024, 03:16I dig how this looks overall. It has a specific theme and edge differentiating itself from the usual, going through the motions fare. I'll be watching.
Quote from: Slash Man on Thu, 9 May 2024, 23:49The first African American police commissioner was appointed in 1984, and this show is supposed to be early 40s?
Indeed. They're going hard on black American Gordon. The Lego movie, The Batman and now this.
Yeah, not sure if you guys noticed, but Harley is also swapped to an Asian chick.
I dunno, I'm not a big fan when they do this, and it looks like they're going out of their way with this show, but whatever, it is what it is. I remember being very vocal about Nolan race swapping Ra's and Bane in his trilogy for some white guys, but again....whatever. If it feels forced, I'll call it out. At least in Nolan's trilogy it felt natural. Same with Matt Reeves' Gordon(who I think is my favorite live action version). So we'll just have to see, but it does feel out of place for the time period. That is something to think about. So we'll see.
But overall, I'm pretty stoked for this show. And it's only a few months away.
Quote from: The Dark Knight on Fri, 10 May 2024, 03:16They're going hard on black American Gordon. The Lego movie, The Batman and now this.
Canonically, Babs is supposed to be a redhead. We know how well redheaded characters do when adapted into other media these days. How else can you have POC Babs unless her old man has been race swapped too?
Quote from: Travesty on Sat, 11 May 2024, 15:16Yeah, not sure if you guys noticed, but Harley is also swapped to an Asian chick.
It's the prerequisite for any show or movie now. Gordon has become black and it seems to be a permanent mainstay. Same for Perry White, at least in the movies. All I can hope for is the main characters remain looking like the main characters. That's thankfully been the case for Batman and Superman so far.
Quote from: Travesty on Sat, 11 May 2024, 15:16Same with Matt Reeves' Gordon(who I think is my favorite live action version).
I have to say the Pattinson/Wright dynamic is probably the best in the film series. I daresay even more so than Bale/Oldman after just one film. They're direct and frequent collaborators out in the field and you feel their mutual trust and respect. So there's that.
Quote from: Travesty on Sat, 11 May 2024, 15:16But overall, I'm pretty stoked for this show. And it's only a few months away.
Same. We also have The Penguin and Joker 2, which makes 2024 a decent year for content.
Quote from: Silver Nemesis on Fri, 10 May 2024, 22:07Quote from: Travesty on Thu, 9 May 2024, 23:02(https://img-s-msn-com.akamaized.net/tenant/amp/entityid/BB1m6Qtt.img?w=768&h=432&m=6)
The purple cowl, dress and cape ensemble has always been my favourite Catwoman costume. I don't know if it'd work in live action, but it looks good here.
I've always been a fan of this cosplay of this iteration that brilliantly used Yvonne Craig's Batgirl cowl for the mask.
https://pin.it/4nV55lvxl
Quote from: thecolorsblend on Sat, 11 May 2024, 16:38Canonically, Babs is supposed to be a redhead. We know how well redheaded characters do when adapted into other media these days. How else can you have POC Babs unless her old man has been race swapped too?
It really is a bizarre and unfortunate stance being taken against redheads. At this point we need Jessica Chastain or someone like her cast as Poison Ivy to restore order.
At some point I'm hoping the Mad Monk/Monster Men arc gets adapted. That has the potential to be one of the best bunch of episodes from anything if done right.