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Author Topic: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)  (Read 5154 times)

Offline Silver Nemesis

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #40 on: Sat, 12 Aug 2017, 02:08 »

Offline thecolorsblend

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #41 on: Sat, 12 Aug 2017, 06:11 »
I'm so up for this series, bro. You can't even guess.

Offline Silver Nemesis

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #42 on: Sat, 12 Aug 2017, 22:13 »
Same here. Iím insanely stoked for this. Itís easily my most hyped CB adaptation of 2017. Are you going to binge watch it or try to pace yourself, colors? I can usually pace myself with Netflix shows, but when it comes to Daredevil I have to binge the entire thing as quickly as possible. Iíll re-watch it at a more measured pace afterwards.

Iím wondering if Mattís going to be revealed as a Black Sky. Maybe heís the one the Hand is really after and theyíre only using Elektra to draw him in.

Will this series mark the end of the Hand in the MCU? Theyíve been a major factor in the Netflix shows since DD season 1, but I canít see where else the writers can go with them once this storylineís concluded. And if they are wiped out, what will replace them as the big bad in the next batch of Marvel shows?

Will the Comic-Con Punisher footage be included after the final episode, the same way the Luke Cage preview footage was included at the end of DD s2?

Who is the mysterious Alexandra? Itís been said sheís an original creation, but will she be revealed as a character from the comics? A human avatar for Mephisto, perhaps?

Will there be any hints about DD season 3? Maybe a Fisk cameo or a Bullseye Easter egg?

Six days to go! The wait's killing me.

Offline thecolorsblend

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #43 on: Sun, 13 Aug 2017, 01:48 »
Same here. Iím insanely stoked for this. Itís easily my most hyped CB adaptation of 2017. Are you going to binge watch it or try to pace yourself, colors? I can usually pace myself with Netflix shows, but when it comes to Daredevil I have to binge the entire thing as quickly as possible. Iíll re-watch it at a more measured pace afterwards.

Iím wondering if Mattís going to be revealed as a Black Sky. Maybe heís the one the Hand is really after and theyíre only using Elektra to draw him in.

Will this series mark the end of the Hand in the MCU? Theyíve been a major factor in the Netflix shows since DD season 1, but I canít see where else the writers can go with them once this storylineís concluded. And if they are wiped out, what will replace them as the big bad in the next batch of Marvel shows?

Will the Comic-Con Punisher footage be included after the final episode, the same way the Luke Cage preview footage was included at the end of DD s2?

Who is the mysterious Alexandra? Itís been said sheís an original creation, but will she be revealed as a character from the comics? A human avatar for Mephisto, perhaps?

Will there be any hints about DD season 3? Maybe a Fisk cameo or a Bullseye Easter egg?

Six days to go! The wait's killing me.
My ability to binge watch depends upon my girlfriend since we watch these Netflix shows together. But next weekend is looking pretty good as far as our availability is concerned so I think we'll be able to knock out at least a few episodes.

One thing I'm not looking forward to is the sudden realization tons of people will have on August 18 that Shadowland has always been their favorite storyline ever. But whatevs...

Offline riddler

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #44 on: Sun, 13 Aug 2017, 03:28 »
I don't really have much to add, sadly I'm without a TV but I do have Netflix but I am extremely excited for this one. I mean this is the Avengers of the Netflix series, how can you not be psyched for that?

Offline Silver Nemesis

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #45 on: Sun, 13 Aug 2017, 18:08 »
I expect the both of you to report back here to discuss the series in depth once youíve finished watching it. In the meantime, hereís the final trailer (unfortunately the uploader seems to have cut off the ending):



A few more questions.

Will Misty Knight finally get her mechanical arm in this series?

Iím confident Danny will get his Iron Fist costume eventually. Thereís been too much backlash for him not to, and the subject keeps getting raised in every cast interview. Charlie Cox even joked about wanting to take Finn Jones to see Potter so he could get his mask. The question is, will he get the costume in The Defenders or Iron Fist season 2?

Will Stone make another appearance? Heís one of the most badass members of the Chaste in the comics, and his cameo in DD s1 was awesome. If this series marks the end of the Hand, will the Chaste disappear also? Stick got killed in the comics. Will he die in this series too?

Five days. Argh!

One thing I'm not looking forward to is the sudden realization tons of people will have on August 18 that Shadowland has always been their favorite storyline ever. But whatevs...

Perhaps this series will challenge people to re-evaluate that story.

Offline Silver Nemesis

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #46 on: Thu, 17 Aug 2017, 17:22 »
Apparently this is the final trailer. The best one yet, IMO.


It looks like Daredevilís cowl has more of a matte finish than when we last saw it, but that could just be the lighting.


Offline Silver Nemesis

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #47 on: Fri, 18 Aug 2017, 23:26 »
I started watching this at 10 am and finished at 10:30 pm. Itís late, so here are just a few random thoughts thrown together quickly. Spoilers ahead.

I enjoyed the series a lot Ė itís my second favourite Marvel Netflix show after Daredevil Ė but I also have a lot of issues with it. The first half of the season was very slow and heavily reliant on exposition. The second half was mostly awesome.

Obviously the writers didnít have the luxury of a plot device like S.H.I.E.L.D. to quickly unite everyone and bring them all up to speed. Instead the characters in The Defenders have to cross paths organically and discover one anotherís secrets a piece at a time. The lives of these heroes are heavily intertwined with those of their supporting casts, making it impossible to extract them from their environments without bringing along a lot of baggage in the process. Because of this the story sometimes felt overstuffed, and I can only imagine how incomprehensible it must be to someone whoís never seen any of these series before now.  But the writers did a good job of making it an ensemble piece, giving each character their own storyline and remaining true to established characterisations. There was no one main star who hogged the spotlight. Itís a true team show.

The idea of each character having their own signature colour was cool, but I felt they overdid the filters a little in the first two or three episodes. Sometimes the screen was so dark I really couldnít see what was happening. I know some people raised this complaint about the Daredevil solo series, but I never had a problem seeing what was going on in that show. In The Defenders, however, I found the screen to be a little too dark at times. But this mostly just applies to the first few episodes. The opening fight scene of episode one was particularly bad in this regard (and the online reports about the Punisher appearing turned out to be false). The choppy editing during that sequence also didnít help. The first couple of episodes in general were a tad over-edited. I was disappointed to see Philip J Silvera didnít handle the choreography. Iím keeping my fingers crossed heíll be back for Daredevil s3. But the photography, editing, cinematography and fight choreography all improved as the season progressed. The fight scenes in the last few episodes were particularly impressive, and the overall look of the show was consistent with the high standard of quality youíd expect from the Marvel Netflix brand.

The production design also deserves a mention. Usually these Netflix shows adhere to a strictly grim and gritty aesthetic, and thereís certainly no shortage of that in The Defenders. But the supernatural subject matter here allowed them to branch out into some more fantastical environments. At first I was a little disappointed when I realised Midland Circle was the MCU version of the Shadowland stronghold, but I ended up really liking those interior sets. They had a surreal and almost sci-fi feel to them. And the tunnels underneath were equally cool. Daredevilís costume has never looked as good in live action as it does in this show, but I was disappointed to see Danny never suited up. The final scene where heís crouching on the rooftop DD-style would have been the perfect place to debut his costume. They could have explained how he got it during a flashback in Iron Fist season 2. That felt like a missed opportunity. Still, I preferred his green threads here to what he wore in the first season of his solo series.

I like how Elektra's characterisation progressed from The Man Without Fear thrill-seeker to the coldblooded assassin of her early comic appearances. Her costume was a big improvement and her action scenes were also impressive. I liked Alexandra for the most part and Sigourney Weaver was great in the role. But shocking though her death scene was, it frustratingly deprived her arc of a substantial payoff. Ultimately her character felt like a lot of build-up for nothing. The same is true of the Handís grand master plan. I canít help being disappointed by the truth behind their big scheme. So all the machinations that began in DD s1 were about digging up some dragon bones so they could procure a substance to extend their lives? And Black Sky, while undeniably badass, was essentially just an enforcer? Honestly, itís not the most satisfying payoff.

And then thereís the ending. Weíve now leapt straight into the middle of Born Again, which forces me to rethink my predictions for DD s3. Weíve skipped the whole first half of that storyline, and Iím not sure how I feel about that. I was hoping The Defenders would end with the status quo intact so I could go straight from DD s2 to s3 when re-watching the series. Now Iíll have to incorporate The Defenders into my viewing schedule. But a Born Again adaptation could still work. More than ever though, they have to bring in Bullseye for s3. At this stage itís a must.

Thatís all Iíll say for now. Iíve focused mostly on the negative here, but there were lots of thing I loved about the show too. Iíll write more about those later.
« Last Edit: Sun, 20 Aug 2017, 13:26 by Silver Nemesis »

Offline riddler

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #48 on: Sat, 19 Aug 2017, 18:56 »
If anyone is interested, I will be doing a review of the first episode on my radio podcast tomorrow (Sunday) at 6:00 pm Eastern time
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/weeklytrendingfandom

Offline Silver Nemesis

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Re: Marvelís The Defenders (Netflix)
« Reply #49 on: Sat, 19 Aug 2017, 19:17 »
I watched Chris Stuckmannís review earlier today and found I agreed with everything he says, except the bit about Foggy and Karen being annoying. But I do agree that Misty Knightís constant interference in the latter part of the season grew tiresome.


Before I begin my second viewing, here are a few additional random thoughts. Spoilers once again.

As far as comic influences go (and that subject definitely deserves its own thread), this was basically a mixture of Frank Millerís Elektra Lives Again, Andy Diggleís Shadowland, and Brian Michael Bendisí 2017 The Defenders Vol 5.

Two movies this show reminded me of were Highlander and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1990). For Highlander youíve got the whole thing about the ancient warriors who can only be killed by decapitation, as well as the scene where Jess discovers the signatures revealing the various aliases Alexandra has used throughout the centuries. For TMNT youíve got the scenes of the four heroes battling hordes of ninja, the final showdown in the tunnels under New York (sewers in TMNT), and the scene where the Defenders escape into the sewers with Stick. The scene where the Hand storm the Chinese restaurant reminded me of the raid on Aprilís apartment in the 1990 film, which was adapted from TMNT Vol 1 #10 (April 1987), which in turn was inspired by a scene from Daredevil Vol 1 #189 (December 1982). So it all comes full circle.

If Elektra wiped out the Chaste, she presumably also killed Stone. Which means theyíll never follow through on his brief appearance in DD s1. Thatís a shame.

There were some interesting deviations from the comic mythology here. In the MCU the Chaste and the Hand are now rooted in the mythology of K'un-Lun. Doesnít this contradict the version of the Handís origins Stick described in DD s2?

It was great to see the Defenders each get improved strength, endurance and combat feats in this show. Luke was able to tank two direct chi punches from Iron Fist, one of which was the most powerful chi blast weíve seen from the MCU Danny to date. Lukeís combat skills also improved to the point where he was able to defeat a highly experienced top tier martial artist like Sowande. After seeing his performance in The Defenders, I now think the MCU Luke would stand a very good chance of taking Captain America in a fight. Jess also got some impressive new feats. This was the first time we got to see her take on skilled martial artists, and she was more than up to the challenge. In addition to one-shotting Iron Fist, she was able to stand toe-to-toe against Madame Gao and take down numerous Hand fodder. The moment where she saved Danny and Luke by flying up and catching the elevator cable was her best agility feat so far.

Matt was able to take on Bakuto and Murakami at the same time, and one of his knee strikes was powerful enough to send Bakuto smashing through a pile of concrete cinder blocks. He also dominated Iron Fist during their brief battle and was able to fight Black Sky Elektra to a standstill (though her confused feelings towards him undoubtedly played a role in this). Dannyís fighting skills also improved in this series, as did his choreography. He was able to summon his Iron Fist with greater speed and consistency, successfully hurt Luke Cage on more than one occasion, and was able to solo against Black Sky Elektra before the rest of the Defenders came to his assistance. As for Elektra, I think sheís more or less rocketed to the top spot on the MCU martial arts league table. Iím not sure if even Cap or Black Panther could take her now. Seriously, the Avengers would be idiots not to use these guys as auxiliaries in the Infinity War.

One or two elements of the plot were predictable. I knew Stick was going to die, and as soon as Misty entered the Midland Circle building I was just waiting for Bakuto to slice off her arm. But Alexandraís death caught me off guard, and I wasnít expecting the series to end the way it did for Matt and Elektra.

With regards to the Daredevil vs. Iron Fist fight, Iím seeing a lot of online debate about whether it was a stalemate or a clear win for Matt. To my mind, this was not a stalemate. Nor was it a stomp. But Matt clearly had the upper hand. He dominated the fight and landed over twice as many hits on Danny as Danny did on him. And two of Dannyís hits were sucker blows: the first when Matt was trying to reason with him, the second when Matt had already stepped down and was backing away. When they were actually fighting, Danny couldnít tag him. But Matt scored numerous blows against Iron Fist.


Matt was comparatively calm and restrained here. If he'd been using his billy clubs and if heíd been bloodlusted like he was when he fought Nobu in the DD s2 finale, Iím confident he wouldíve wrecked Iron Fist in this scene. Matt did better soloing against Elektra than Danny did and was practically able to stalemate her. Even Stick said that Matt was more worthy to lead the Chaste than Iron Fist. So I think itís fair to say that Daredevil>Iron Fist is now canon in the MCU.

Regarding the ending, now that Iíve had more time to think about it Iím actually happy they ended the season with that Born Again scene. We now know for a fact that Born Again will be at least partly adapted in season 3. The very next scene has to be Matt meeting Sister Maggie, which is the middle act of BA. This means weíve skipped the whole first half of the story, but even that can still be loosely adapted (I never expected a literal scene-by-scene adaptation, as 13 episodes would be far too long for that). In the MCU Fiskís vendetta is not solely against Daredevil, but against Nelson & Murdock. He said he was going to target Foggy when he got out of jail and thatís what I think will happen. Instead of seeing Fisk destroy Mattís life, weíll likely see him go after Foggy, Karen and Melvin Potter. If Matt recovers from his injuries and returns to his old life quickly enough, then I suppose Fisk might also target him. But I think itís more likely the first half of season 3 will focus on Matt getting to know Maggie and discovering the truth behind his family history, while Foggy and Karen are targeted by Fisk. Then, when things are at their worst, Daredevil will return to restore the balance. We were never going to get the BA beatdown between Fisk and Matt anyway, since they already adapted that in DD s1. So Iím happy for them to reorder the sequence of events a little. Like I say, we now know for a fact that DD s3 will be at least partly based on Born Again. And thatís awesome.
« Last Edit: Sat, 19 Aug 2017, 23:21 by Silver Nemesis »

 

    
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